crl -- change? scout strapping lvl 2

[762s[TX]]

heya,

 

is the shadow scouts crl referenced from the biker scout?

i know the biker scout crl has been updated when new information was found ... and well, shouldnt the shadow scout match the biker scout as the we know the biker scouts crl is screen accurate?

 

i see some things with the strapping that doesnt match ...

 

~ shoulder armor

- shadow uses 35mm / 1 3/8" strapping

- biker uses 12mm / 1/2" strapping

 

~ upper arm armor

- shadow uses 35mm / 1 3/8" strapping

- biker uses 50mm / 2" strapping

 

~ forearm

- shadow and biker are the same -- 25mm / 1" strapping

 

~ chest armor/back armor

- shadow uses 50mm / 2" strapping

- biker uses 40mm / 1 1/2" strapping

 

~ knee armor -- see post below

- shadow uses 25mm / 1" strapping for the bottom

- biker uses 15mm / 5/8" strapping for the bottom

 

- shadow uses 12mm / 1/2" strapping for the top

- biker uses 20mm / 3/4" strapping for the top

 

~ boots

- shadows basic crl doesnt mention the 25mm / 1" velcro for the boot rear fastening system, it is under the lvl 2 crl

- bikers basic crl has this mentioned as being needed for basic

 

 

like i said above, i would think the shadow scout is referenced from the biker scout and i believe the shadow scouts crl strapping could use an update.

 

either way, im working my shadow scout strapping to match the biker scouts strapping, if this causes an issue with me trying to gain lvl 2 on my shadow scout then so be it, basic will be fine for me then.

as in my mind the strapping with the biker scout is the most screen accurate and thats how i will rebuild my shadow scout

 

thanks for your consideration of possibly changing the shadow scouts crl to match the screen accurate biker scout strapping!

[762s[TX]]

i would like to add/point out that the crl for biker scout on the knee armor is wrong ...

 

for what recruits can see, the crl states in 2 different areas:

 

the main crl ... http://databank.501s...B_Scout_trooper

 

and the lancer spec crl posted here ... http://forum.bikersc...showtopic=12081

 

from the main crl:

• The first is 15mm (5/8") wide and passes through the bottom of the knee armor.
  
• The second is 20mm (3/4") wide and riveted to the top sides of the knee armor
  

from the posted lancer crl:

 

11. Knee armor to have two elastic straps , one passing through the knee armor 20mm (5/8") wide on the bottom and one 20mm (3/4") fixed to the top sides of the knee armour with one silver rivet each side.

 

 

and from what im gathering it is supposed to be:

 

From lancers standards: (an area recruits can not see/dont have access to)

http://forum.bikersc...showtopic=15994

 

"Knee armor to have two elastic straps , one passing through the knee armor 20mm (5/8") wide on the bottom and one 12mm (1/2") fixed to the top sides of the knee armor with one silver rivet each side."[/background]

 

 

 

 

 

so, with that the op should be:

 

~ knee armor

- shadow uses 25mm / 1" strapping for the bottom

- biker uses 15mm / 5/8" strapping for the bottom

 

- shadow uses 12mm / 1/2" strapping for the top

- biker uses 20mm / 1/2" strapping for the top

 

so, now the top knee strapping is the same with shadow and biker scout

[Darth Emphatic[CMD-DWM]]

Keep in mind while the biker scout is the brother to the shadow scout, it has different sources and can generate differences in the crl's and measurements. It is more than just a black biker scout.

[Griffin-X[501st]]

The issue has been corrected on the Pathfinders CRL and internal Lancer standards.

[Harbinger33[501st]]

Keep in mind while the biker scout is the brother to the shadow scout, it has different sources and can generate differences in the crl's and measurements. It is more than just a black biker scout.

I'm just wondering why this is the stance, when it would be easier to just copy/paste TB CRLs for the Shadow Scout and Swamp Trooper. The Shadowtrooper has a nearly identical CRL to the TK (down to level 2/3 such as flexible hand guards, rivets etc.), why the needless distinction with the scouts? IMO since there are no film dources for the Shadow (or other color variants) might as well use the films for reference. The Empire is all about conformity.

[762s[TX]]

I'm just wondering why this is the stance, when it would be easier to just copy/paste TB CRLs for the Shadow Scout and Swamp Trooper. The Shadowtrooper has a nearly identical CRL to the TK (down to level 2/3 such as flexible hand guards, rivets etc.), why the needless distinction with the scouts? IMO since there are no film dources for the Shadow (or other color variants) might as well use the films for reference. The Empire is all about conformity.

 

thank you!

 

its nice to see someone thinking outside the box with me about this crl with "scouts"

 

they use comics/games/cartoon/figurines to make a crl ... when the original costume is in a movie and museums to get some real references from, ie: strapping.

all those comics/games/cartoon/figurines are subject to an artists rendering and the details are just not there, ie shoulder strapping on the figurine is not there!

 

i have heard it couple times around here, not just in this post ... "the shadow scout is more than a black biker scout" and "it has different sources" ... im sorry but, it is just a black/green biker scout.

 

there are plenty of references the are not in the crl ... silver imperial cog on the left chest, grey detailing(seen more than not and its not acceptable for specialist ?), flat black armor, blue grey or dark grey flight suit to name a few things that have been overlooked with this costumes crl and then we are being told some things(black flight suit) are about conformity.....what?!

 

seems more like the crl was done(rushed) in the easiest way to make a crl for a costume(in all black) and alot was disregarded from costume references which could make it more than an all black biker scout!

 

im up for adjusting this crl ... just need the powers that be to be willing to do so and work through it with us.

[retrofire[501st]]

These are great points. The problem with comics, games, and animated is the inconsistencies in the characters usually due to the artists. JRS found this with the Battlefront II and the Pathfinders with the Rebels Biker Scout. In the case of the Rebels Biker Scout there was no strapping to be seen as the animators didn't add it in. That being said I agree with making the CRL better where SpecOps can but I don't think you can just cut/paste the Biker Scout CRL paint it black (or green) and say it's good. What I suggest is to start a new thread where the references are posted and allow the members of the det to review and make suggestions as to what should be changed. Some things might be obvious and others can be agreed upon. Either way the references will make a big difference.

[Darth Emphatic[CMD-DWM]]

Thanks, Peter. I agree, it would be the right say to approach it. I still dream of a day where we have two specialist paths for our EU costumes, one for screen accuracy and one for art accuracy. For example, the lancer requirements would work for the screen ccurste path, whereas the art path would join all the comic references into different requirements. Sadly, the current crl structure with L2 LIKE doesn't support something like this yet.

[762s[TX]]

thanks peter and steve for the info and helping us/me understand why things are the way they are. and thanks for being patient and understanding with this ... im still new to how things work and how to get things changed but, im learning

 

i think i will pull some sources and get some pictures together and make a new thread then ... like a proposal for shadow scout crl changes.

 

i do like the split crl method you mentioned steve ... and maybe, just something as simple as making 2 different costumes with a designation at the end to note the build type of the costume.

for instance Shadow Scout SA and Shadow Scout AA (SA screen accurate and AA Art Accurate)

 

similar to what they have done with the boba fett special edition crl ...

 

"In the creation of the Special Editions, Boba Fett was inserted into additional scenes. This costume did not match any of the previously established configurations, mingling elements from ESB and RotJ. The suit is designated by two variations, the filming version and promo shot version. The differences in the promo shot version will be notated by specific costume pieces below. You must specify which version of the suit you're doing for approval purposes."

 

 

so, lets see what we can do here with the shadow scout to get some good changes to its crl

[retrofire[501st]]

Boba is a great example of this. There are the two versions for ESB and ROTJ but also the version that was originally designed by Ralph McQuarrie. The BH det has five versions of Fett that are in work that are pre production versions. These are just a few examples of how CRLs have split off into their own areas between art and film. I think you have some great ideas and posting up the scout references allows folks like Antje and Steve to get the membership engaged. This has always been an accommodating det and I'm sure they would be happy to help to include a new costume to the SpecOps family.