complete Sithtrooper Boots & Boot Armor - Draft CRL Development Discussion

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

@Raider  were in agreement, level of gloss does not change basic approval, but will affect Specialist. 

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

On 4/27/2020 at 11:01 PM, Raider said:

Cool thanks!  Is the vertical zipper hidden anyways by the armor?  L2 if so I think as a GML wouldnt see it.

FOTK CRL has it L1, I don't mind pushing it to L2 for Sith Trooper

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

36 minutes ago, Blackwatch said:

@Raider  were in agreement, level of gloss does not change basic approval, but will affect Specialist. 

I think there's a couple of things at play here to achieve the basic look of the costume; colour and gloss. The boot is clearly high gloss and the same colour as the rest of the armour, when viewed from any distance.

The trick is wording this in a way that we get a perceptible differences, but not an extreme ones. Please let me know if there are issues with the text that is in place currently. 

[gmrhodes13[501st]]

39 minutes ago, nanotek said:

FOTK CRL has it L1, I don't mind pushing it to L2 for Sith Trooper

Correct but that CRL has just had an update, when the CRL went live OT ANH/ESB boots were allowable due to boot availability  

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

45 minutes ago, gmrhodes13 said:

Correct but that CRL has just had an update, when the CRL went live OT ANH/ESB boots were allowable due to boot availability  

Yeah I noticed that the OT boots had been removed

[RAIDER[COTG]]

13 hours ago, nanotek said:

FOTK CRL has it L1, I don't mind pushing it to L2 for Sith Trooper

True...but even still that doesnt necessarily mean it should be the way to go.   For a basic approval how would a GML verify that?  If its visible on standard approval pics keep it L1 for sure, but if not and the armor would need to be removed with additional pics to verify...well thats L2 material all day Id say and sounds like what we would require for a Specialist app.

For me with that switch, these should be all set.  Lookin good.

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

On 4/29/2020 at 10:16 PM, Raider said:

True...but even still that doesnt necessarily mean it should be the way to go.   For a basic approval how would a GML verify that?  If its visible on standard approval pics keep it L1 for sure, but if not and the armor would need to be removed with additional pics to verify...well thats L2 material all day Id say and sounds like what we would require for a Specialist app.

For me with that switch, these should be all set.  Lookin good.

Following the logic we probably need to make all non-visible elements from a distance into L2. No one will ever see the seams from a distance, nor the toe and heel patches with the knurled pattern. I'll draft that up now

[RAIDER[COTG]]

54 minutes ago, nanotek said:

Following the logic we probably need to make all non-visible elements from a distance into L2. No one will ever see the seams from a distance, nor the toe and heel patches with the knurled pattern. I'll draft that up now

As long as the general consensus is it wont affect the overall “look” of the costume sure.

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Text has been updated

 

[gmrhodes13[501st]]

Looks good

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

1 minute ago, Raider said:

As long as the general consensus is it wont affect the overall “look” of the costume sure.

I think given the the colour red has a lot of "bleed", most of the finer details will disappear. Especially with photography.

[RAIDER[COTG]]

Just to verify the adjustment to recessed lines...Level 2 specifies an amount while Level 1 leaves that more open?

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

2 minutes ago, Raider said:

Just to verify the adjustment to recessed lines...Level 2 specifies an amount while Level 1 leaves that more open?

This is the part that troubles me. I'm going to try and break this down as best as I can.

1. We have some parts where we can clearly see/count how many recessed lines there and there would be little to know deviation on this no matter how big/small you are. Handplates, boots, helmet etc Other parts there may be an overlap, or we cannot get clear references to count. 

2. Combine this with the complexity of GML approval, what can be seen and what would be a reasonable expectation for a GML to count all the lines. If L1 is about achieving the 'overall look', but then:

3. Throw the fact that we don't want members replicating the toys. There are clear differences between the toy and costume when it comes to the number of lines.

4. Consistency - I'm not comfortable being prescriptive for some things, then being non-prescriptive on other things. Consistency will help keep the CRL simple.

These are the 4 factors that I try to keep in mind while reviewing the L1 and L2. Maybe we can throw this up for discussion once the whole CRL is up and ready for final review?

[ukswrath[TX]]

From a former DOs perspective, some GMLs will take CRL requirements with a grain of salt, others as if  the info came straight from Disney and LFLs "Must have to troop" play book and try and enforce L3 at basic. It's was very frustrating.

In my opinion L1 & L2 should be seen as guidelines. L1 for the casual enthusiast who may troop once or twice a year at some low key event. Doesn't really care too much about accuracy but still wants to help others, the highlight of our legion. L2 a step above is for those active, engaged, in the trenches and yet no where close to being OCD.

L3 is the cream of the crop without the movie gaffers tape.   

Above that is RPF and SWAT. RPF where everything in the movie is on the table, or MEPD every character detail is under a microscope. Being a SWAT member myself, if were not careful to select a clear and realistic level of detail, very few will strive for it or worse some approvers will impose their opinion of what they believe it should be. After 4 years I can still count the amount of TFA FOTK L3 recipients on less than two hands, mainly because at L3 rubber gaskets that nobody wants to buy or wear are required.

Long story short let's set each "L" bar realistically and be very clear about the expectations.      

[RAIDER[COTG]]

On 5/1/2020 at 9:34 PM, nanotek said:

This is the part that troubles me. I'm going to try and break this down as best as I can.

1. We have some parts where we can clearly see/count how many recessed lines there and there would be little to know deviation on this no matter how big/small you are. Handplates, boots, helmet etc Other parts there may be an overlap, or we cannot get clear references to count. 

2. Combine this with the complexity of GML approval, what can be seen and what would be a reasonable expectation for a GML to count all the lines. If L1 is about achieving the 'overall look', but then:

3. Throw the fact that we don't want members replicating the toys. There are clear differences between the toy and costume when it comes to the number of lines.

4. Consistency - I'm not comfortable being prescriptive for some things, then being non-prescriptive on other things. Consistency will help keep the CRL simple.

These are the 4 factors that I try to keep in mind while reviewing the L1 and L2. Maybe we can throw this up for discussion once the whole CRL is up and ready for final review?

I think we are generally safe in line counts going to L2...even for everything.  Most people will be buying kits based off of film references.  I'd also wager that the majority build off the CRL pics as their primary reference, not the actual references threads (including the toy references) aside from an applicant here or there...or the first batch of troopers who don't have a CRL to reference from.  All that to say that I believe most people won't base their build off the Hot Toy references...but even if they did, I'm not certain that affects the general look of a Level 1 Sith Trooper...no one would notice the line counts.  For a GML...an approx. should work so there are no major deviations.

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Yep noted, thanks guys.

So are we done here guys?

@Raider @gmrhodes13 @JoeShoe @rickyboyblue @ukswrath @Blackwatch

[gmrhodes13[501st]]

All good here @nanotek

[JoeShoe[TX]]

Just getting caught up on all these threads.  My apologies, im actually a principal scientist in Vaccine development.  its been a busy time, as i'm sure you've guessed. 

 

Anywho, This looks good to me.  My concerns have been addressed above.  

[ukswrath[TX]]

4 hours ago, JoeShoe said:

Just getting caught up on all these threads.  My apologies, im actually a principal scientist in Vaccine development.  its been a busy time, as i'm sure you've guessed. 

Thank you for your service during this critical time  

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Text moved to New CRL Proposal