Questions regarding recess and highlight painting

[Tiderion]

For the small recesses in the armor and for the accent painting on a couple of the armor pieces ( As seen here: https://databank.501st.com/databank/File:Tx_imperial_death_trooper_abdomen_color_scheme.png and here:

https://databank.501st.com/databank/File:Tx_imperial_death_trooper_chest_color_scheme.png)

I have a couple of questions:

1. Should the recesses on the rest of the armor pieces match these armor highlights or not?

2.  Whether yes or no, what metallic dark grey (I'd assume not spraypaint would be easiest, particularly for the grooves) is a good choice?

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

Hello, James!

As far as the weathering goes with recessed areas and the rest of the armor allows for very narrow liberty with that as long as it matches the rest of the costume in uniformity. In that gallery section of the CRL there are additional pictures showing other pieces that are weathered but not specified in specific part weathering. I'd say as long as you follow that you'll be in good shape!

With the additional weathering it looks like the weathered silver looks pretty close to many of them. @Chaos  @Lt. Dan may have some additional guidance for this, so I'll give them a chance to respond as well  

[Tiderion]

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I didn't perceive weathering and the recess coloring to be the same topic.  Quoting from the official CRL regarding the biceps, it reads as follows:

• Shallow grooves are present in a pattern matching the photo.
  1.     -The grooves may be a matte black, metallic black, matte silver, or gray.
  •      -If coloring is used, the shoulder bells, biceps, forearms, and thighs must match.
• Biceps may be slightly weathered but must be uniform with the rest of the costume.

Those are separate bullet points on the guidelines, and the coloring instructions (matte black, metallic black, etc) are listed under the grooves instructions, whereas the weathering is a completely separate bullet point.  Maybe I'm reading that wrong, but that's what makes the most sense to me.

Here is the link of what I'm referencing:

https://databank.501st.com/databank/Costuming:TX_deathtrooper

Furthermore, when you look at the zoomed in photo, you can clearly see the offset color of the recessed area:

So my question was do those recessed areas' colors need to be the same or different than the abdomen and chest highlight areas?

To me the coloring on the bicep recess looks ever so slightly darker, but that could be a trick of the eyes and lighting.  The reference for the chest piece also includes a shorter, slightly different list of coloring for these highlights which seems somewhat inconsistent with what's listed on the coloring chart.

The recesses and asymmetric panels may be matte or metallic black 

The reference document says "matte or metallic black" but the hyperlink for the coloring guide lists "metallic dark grey"

@Lt. Dan @Chaos Can we get some guidance/clarity on this?

[Lt. Dan[501st]]

First of all, thanks for the trust that is put here in my opinion, but I am not the official costume advisor this is @Chaos and he should comment on these subtleties. I had problems with the colors myself, but I strictly followed the colour scheme guide and the CRL. As for the paint code for dark metallic gray, Tamiya metallic black TS40 is recommended.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

6 hours ago, Tiderion said:

Perhaps I'm wrong, but I didn't perceive weathering and the recess coloring to be the same topic.  Quoting from the official CRL regarding the biceps, it reads as follows:

• Shallow grooves are present in a pattern matching the photo.
  1.     -The grooves may be a matte black, metallic black, matte silver, or gray.
  •      -If coloring is used, the shoulder bells, biceps, forearms, and thighs must match.
• Biceps may be slightly weathered but must be uniform with the rest of the costume.

Those are separate bullet points on the guidelines, and the coloring instructions (matte black, metallic black, etc) are listed under the grooves instructions, whereas the weathering is a completely separate bullet point.  Maybe I'm reading that wrong, but that's what makes the most sense to me.

Here is the link of what I'm referencing:

https://databank.501st.com/databank/Costuming:TX_deathtrooper

Furthermore, when you look at the zoomed in photo, you can clearly see the offset color of the recessed area:

So my question was do those recessed areas' colors need to be the same or different than the abdomen and chest highlight areas?

To me the coloring on the bicep recess looks ever so slightly darker, but that could be a trick of the eyes and lighting.  The reference for the chest piece also includes a shorter, slightly different list of coloring for these highlights which seems somewhat inconsistent with what's listed on the coloring chart.

The recesses and asymmetric panels may be matte or metallic black 

The reference document says "matte or metallic black" but the hyperlink for the coloring guide lists "metallic dark grey"

@Lt. Dan @Chaos Can we get some guidance/clarity on this?

James, sorry, I think I worded it poorly. What I was meaning to say is that yes the parts that have the specific coloring are separate when it comes to coloring with other parts that aren't listed with a specific coloring scheme. I was more pointing out that the recessed areas should be uniform with the rest of the costume when it comes to coloring. We don't specifically call out a weathering color for the rest of the parts but I'd go with a flat black similar that is used on your chest example. That looks very close the CRL images on the recessed areas. @Lt. Dan, what did you use in your recessed areas on the biceps, forearms, etc. for the parts that didn't call for a specific coloring scheme?

I'll raise the question with the rest of the team to see if there is a discontinuity with the text. These are living/breathing documents that can be changed if we notice an error or references surface that would otherwise warrant a change.

[Chaos[CMD-DCA]]

Ok here is the intent of the coloring and weathering: (and I was sure it was rather obvious)

Coloring, if an item lists a specific coloring in the grooves/recesses that means it must be that color, it is says "may" then if you choose to color the grooves/recess they can be painted either color. Keep in mind that if you are going for Level 2, and the CRL says use the Color Scheme Galley, then all the recesses/groves must match.

You can leave everything painted gloss black and be perfectly legal per the CRL except where it lists an asymmetrical panel color scheme IAW the Color Scheme Gallery.

However, there was a time when the Tamiya  Metallic Black TS40 was not available, so to give the armor that screen look of different lighting effects, it was determined that a matte black would give the same effect. This enable builders to meet CRL requirements and it also eliminated people from choosing just any "Metallic Black" paint and using something that totally didn't look right.

Don't over think the process, if the item refers to the Color Scheme Gallery then use that. If it says "may be matte or metallic black" and you don't have the Tamiya, then you can use matte and you will be IAW CRL requirements.

I happen to like the look of the matte black in my recesses and grooves over the dark gray, or matte silver, or metallic black, but that is just my preference. However I did paint IAW the Color Scheme Gallery when applicable. Just make sure if you do paint the recesses they have to be consistent across the whole armor.

 

Now weathering, this is touchy subject with me, and we intentionally mentioned it in the CRL: "may be slightly weathered to produce a worn look. The weathering must be uniform across all costume parts. If weathered, a light gray or white tint paint wash, or dry brush technique, or powder dusting may be used to create the oxidized or dirty effect. More information can be found in the Gallery Weathering Guide."

I have seen people weather their armor so much that I thought I was looking at a Sand Trooper that had been banged up by a Banta against an outcropping of rocks. In the movie you will see the DTs "dirty after a battle" and later on they will be all clean and shiny. They are Elite Operators so they will always take care of their equipment more so than a normal grunt. 

To create my weathering I used a light gray craft acrylic paint, watered down and applied to the areas I wanted to have a little "dusting" with an airbrush, you can get the same effect with just a soft bristled 2 inch craft brush. When you apply the paint let it dry, then using a dry soft cloth wipe and buff away the paint from the smooth surfaces, this will leave the "dust" in the corners and crevices. If not enough comes off with the dry cloth you can always slightly dampen the cloth with water and wipe the armor down. I prefer the acrylic craft paint because if I decide to wear my armor to an event where I feel the DT would be cleaned up and looking pristine, I can take soap and water and completely remove all the "weathering" then Boom! I'm back to looking like I just walked out of the factory with a fresh coat of paint.

I hope this helps answer your questions. Just remember to not over think the paint and weathering. 

 

[Tiderion]

@Chaos

10 hours ago, Chaos said:

 

Don't over think the process, if the item refers to the Color Scheme Gallery then use that. If it says "may be matte or metallic black" and you don't have the Tamiya, then you can use matte and you will be IAW CRL requirements.

I happen to like the look of the matte black in my recesses and grooves over the dark gray, or matte silver, or metallic black, but that is just my preference. However I did paint IAW the Color Scheme Gallery when applicable. Just make sure if you do paint the recesses they have to be consistent across the whole armor.

Thank you for your response, here is my hangup which I think got lost in the shuffle of discussion here - The longform Deathtrooper webpage and the specific coloring guideline do not seem to match:

Here it says "may be matte or metallic black"

Whereas here it specifically says "Metallic Dark Grey" and then goes on to reference the Tamiya  Metallic Black TS40  that you mentioned.

https://databank.501st.com/databank/File:Tx_imperial_death_trooper_chest_color_scheme.png

So which one can I say is the source of truth?

[Chaos[CMD-DCA]]

@Tiderion Let me try to clarify, in my post I made a statement: "However, there was a time when the Tamiya  Metallic Black TS40 was not available, so to give the armor that screen look of different lighting effects, it was determined that a matte black would give the same effect. This enable builders to meet CRL requirements and it also eliminated people from choosing just any "Metallic Black" paint and using something that totally didn't look right."

This was done so that as the CRL was updated, previous builders kits would still be Level 1 compliant. Even now if a builder does not have Tamiya TS40 and it is not available they can use a matte black to achieve the same effect that the Tamiya metallic black TS40 provides. The reference to the Color Scheme for those individuals is to provide them with where the asymmetrical painting is to be done if they only can use matte. If they use a metallic black it will be the Tamiya TS40.

The Color Scheme is the preferred color painting colors and their locations, the Scheme says Metallic Dark Grey because that is indeed what the Tamiya Metallic Black TS40 is:

  

The CRL lists what may be used: matte black or metallic black. So, if you use matte black; the Color Scheme tells you where it must be located, if you use metallic black; the Color Scheme list what color is preferred (Tamiya TS40) and where it must be located.

You can say as well as the rest of us that BOTH sources are the "source of truth."

I hope that helps clarify the "why, what, and where."