CRL Update Discussion - Helmet [PASSED]

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

It was recently brought to the attention of the detachment that the Biker Scout ROTJ costume is getting a CRL update to ban the use of Walt's Trooper Factory (WTF) scout helmets from L1 (basic) approval. I have initially responded to the posting with the following response:

I'll have a discussion with the team, but as of right now I don't not have plans to follow suit as Pathfinders (at no discredit to them or at arms with them). Our character has been based on comic book and low-poly video game characters. We do have provisions in our CRL that follow the Pathfinder's ROTJ CRL to allow for the easier building of costume with shared details.

However, I do believe this could be addressed in updating the CRL to state "Scout style helmet accurate in shape and form as per the reference image"; although one can argue that the CRL text already addresses this by stating "Text descriptions are only one part of the guideline. GMLs and costumers must consider both text and pictures (CRL and Reference) when reviewing the costume."

I too have assisted in the building of a WTF helmet and costume with a fellow member and had the same results. Basic approval to me comes back to allowing the best access to parts to make the costume. The proper work can be put in to make the WTF helmet work and be approvable globally at L1.

With that being said, it is in the best interest of the detachment to bring this to a public discussion which will also tag in our various detachment costume advisors (DCAs) to get us in the right direction.

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

I have a WTF helmet that I won in the Stop Soldier Suicide prevention fundraiser giveaway. Now that I have it iin hand, I see two things-

The shape IS different from my other helmets (Cuckblack and Spike). The snout slopes back at the top, and the visor extends forward extending over the front edge of the snout at the top. This is clearly differnt from what our source art shows.  The source art indicaes a short visor, nearly vertical, with the visor stopping short of the snout. 

As Ryan pointed out, our sources are game art, comics and other sources which do not match.  But, as an owner of a WTF helmet, Id say it does not quite align with the images ot of the art. Other helmets do the same and this is in no way a slam against Walt or his work. But, the helemt itself would need work to match our references, primarily making sure that the snout is vertical and not sloped.  

If you take a look at our CRL for the shadow scout, the helmet David is wearing has the same or similar slope of the visor, which does not match the art. I dont know that ANY helmet matches that angle without surgury. 

[RAIDER[COTG]]

I’m a visual guy so I had a hard time following what you meant there @Blackwatch (side note thats not me in the CRL, I just snapped the pics…that kit is a Chef’s Props kit btw).  Anyways, I do agree…no slam on Walt as a person BUT i never was a fan of the helmet and felt it didnt resemble  screen used (let alone our low-res computer graphic references for Storm Commandos…u see what I did there 😂 ) very well.  To me it’s as plain as day when you just look at these two pics (the WTF pic pulled from Mickey’s DL announcement over at Pathfinders) the WTF mold is very far off from what we know to be a scout helmet.

ROTJ

 

WTF

 

Storm Commando Game Reference - Here it is a low quality image so tough to see BUT you can see the visor does not sit as low to lens as the WTF

Im not even gonna reference the card game images because those really are other costume variations of the Storm Commando…the Captain, Special Agent or Scout being the closest tour current Shadow Scout costume…but those are also hand drawn images so shape variation is expected and can be interpreted to a degree.

In this case in particular though, scout parts are available in multiple areas outside of the US let alone within and I dont think we can leverage that as a reason to keep it.  I would be more in favor avoiding builder confusion and in a decision such as this, align.  I dont equate this with differing measurements on straps.

Thats my thoughts anyways.

[Jsilvius]

As someone who is building this kit currently, just for the sake of simplicity, I would consider following the Pathies down this rabbit hole. Mostly just because I and others that I know have used the build threads on their detachment to help build their kits, and having two Detachments with the same "style" of helmet but one allowing a specific version and the other not, might cause some confusion on the builder's end.

[RAIDER[COTG]]

I think the other aspect to consider…GMLs.  Keep it simple for them by staying consistent.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

I agree, that is the consideration. We are going to take a look at that this weekend with some of the DCA training we have going on.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

Just an update to this that we will be moving forward with following the Pathfinders detachment to effectively prohibit Walt's Trooper Factory (WTF) version 1 (v1) helmet (as seen below) for basic approval on the following costumes after a 6-month grace period (detailed below):

• General Weir
• Shadow Scout
• Swamp Trooper

An image of the WTF V1 helmet that will no longer be approvable:

We are going to allow a 6-month grace period from today's date for the approval of any costumes that are currently being worked on with this helmet. The last day to get approval will be November 19, 2024. After this date the CRLs will have text added to it stating that the WTF v1 scout helmet is no longer approvable for basic approval.

I'm sure there are other questions related to this, so we'll break it out like the Pathfinders did:

• What if I already have an approved kit?
  • You will not need to do anything. Any costume that has been approved within the 501st Legion is grandfathered in, so long as the member remains active.
• What if I have the helmet but don't have the kit yet finished?
  • You will have until November 19, 2024 to get everything completed and approved by your GML.
• What if I have the helmet and was retired from the 501st Legion and wish to be reactivated?
  • You will have until November 19, 2024 to get your costume approved by your GML to move you back to active status (this is just like initial approval for the costume)