(SW Legion) Imperial Special Forces Trooper

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

PLACEHOLDER FOR IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES TROOPER FOUND IN STAR WARS LEGION TABLETOP MINIATURES GAME.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

This is to explore a possible CRL for "Imperial Special Forces Trooper" as identified above.

The game identifies Inferno Squad as a sub-unit of a force known as "Imperial Special Forces", who are shown to wear the same kit as Inferno Squad but in black and white instead of black and red.

For this, we'll focus on the Imperial Special Forces Trooper, who wears an almost identical kit to Iden Versio. The primary differences are:

- No red stripes on the flightsuit.

- Red Inferno shoulder patches replaced by white Imperial cogs.

- No red markings or lenses on the helmet.

- Red Inferno symbol and red cog on the helmet replaced with either white variants or the same, or dual white cogs.

- No shoulder pauldron.

- Armed with an E-11 with a tactical flashlight fitted to the right side of the barrel.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Just as a side note for future reference, if we get this one finished there are two further ISF variants identified:

"T-21 Special Forces Trooper" - as above, but with Gideon Hask's bandolier and a T-21 blaster.

"Imperial Special Forces Unit Leader" - as above, but with an all black shoulder pauldron.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Before beginning, it's important to identify some discrepancies between the licenced sculpts and their official promotion, and the card art that accompanies them.

The sculpts and their promotional images show an outfit that is virtually identical to Inferno, except for the changes identified above.

The card art is mostly the same, but with three important differences (thanks @IcyTrooperor the higher res image!).

1) Right side of the helmet has a white version of the Inferno logo, as opposed to the white Imperial cog shown on the box and instructional leaflet art. Do we treat this as an optional variant? Ie. Either two white cogs, or a white Inferno logo on the right side and a white cog on the left?

2) Two of the ISF troops on the card art have pouches on their right arm that do not match Inferno kit, nor are present on any of the 3D sculpts produced for the unit. So we'll need to decide whether we treat these as an "optional" detail, or discount them?

3) The card art shows dual internal flashlights on the E-11s, with no external change to the outside appearance of the blasters. The sculpts and their promotional art shows instead a tactical flashlight fixed to the outside right side of the E-11 barrel.

I think we need the same answer to all three questions - either we disregard the beautiful card art completely as it's too different to the licensed 3D sculpts, or we treat its differences as optional details/variants.

[RAIDER[COTG]]

Typically @tipperaryred it is in reverse…where action figures (in this case the miniatures) get disregarded, not the art.  That being said, consistency over 25 years on whats done hasnt been the best.  The question I have…is there enough art to support a CRL and build (front back sides) OR will the LMOs allow the use of the miniatures to “fill in gaps” that art doesn’t give such as the back?

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

We will need the ALMO or LMO to weigh in with that decision; I am for the option to build one as you want it, but you cannot mix and match parts.   Is there any more art other than the card image?

 

 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

3 hours ago, RAIDER said:

Typically @tipperaryred it is in reverse…where action figures (in this case the miniatures) get disregarded, not the art.  That being said, consistency over 25 years on whats done hasnt been the best.  The question I have…is there enough art to support a CRL and build (front back sides) OR will the LMOs allow the use of the miniatures to “fill in gaps” that art doesn’t give such as the back?

Thanks @RAIDER

I think if we're told that we do have to rely primarily on the stylised card art, there would be no point proceeding.  It's one single image, not hugely detailed, and just not consistent with any other material (box art, miniatures or existing Inferno references and CRLs).  Looking again, not even the flightsuit has any pockets in the places you'd expect to see them on an Inferno (or even on a TIE flightsuit).

So unless anyone can think of a better solution, it sounds like the only feasible option would be to use the existing Inferno CRLs (primarily Iden Versio's) as a baseline and present an Imperial Special Forces Trooper on that basis.  Within the game, the Inferno and ISF sculpts are entirely interchangeable, with only the red or white colour schemes distinguishing between their kit.  Considering they are only about 36mm high, there is a huge amount of detail sculpted in and all of it conforms perfectly with Iden's CRL; from the flightsuit pen sleeves, to the thermal detonator greebles, down to the buckles on the boots.

So, I think a case possibly could be made for starting the new CRL with a copy and paste job from Iden for a helmet, balaclava, flightsuit, compad, gloves, torso armour, ammo belt, holster, thermal detonator and boots.  Chest box and hoses as the usual optional features, and leave out the pauldron entirely.

If that much was acceptable, then it would be a matter of getting approval for the different colour scheme (obviously I can't just paint one however I want and submit that ? ).  There are however two very clear views from the front right and front left on the box and instructional leaflet art that show the miniatures painted up by the licenced studio's own in house team.

 

 

These clearly show the red flightsuit stripes are gone, the red helmet markings and decals are gone, the red lenses are gone, and the red shoulder patches are gone.  At the same time it clearly shows white Imperial cogs replacing both the shoulder patches and both of the helmet decals.  Every other detail seems to match up perfectly with the Inferno kit.  Colour-wise, the only piece of kit we can't see is the thermal detonator.  Given that its greebles match up perfectly with Iden's TD, and that nothing else in the kit has changed, I hope it won't be a stretch to suggest that it is identical to Iden's as well?

Those two images above are the only other relevant art @Blackwatch

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

I agree that Iden will be the starting point to prong off of.  I ran into all issues listed when I wrote the 181st CRL way back when and none of the art matched. Not even close. 

Is the figure the same sculpt that is used in any tabletop version of any other game, or is this a new, unique sculpt? That would answer the question about the TD in the back. 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

5 minutes ago, Blackwatch said:

I agree that Iden will be the starting point to prong off of.  I ran into all issues listed when I wrote the 181st CRL way back when and none of the art matched. Not even close. 

Is the figure the same sculpt that is used in any tabletop version of any other game, or is this a new, unique sculpt? That would answer the question about the TD in the back. 

Ah don't, the 181st was nearly my first costume ahead of Del and I had a nightmare trying to reconcile all the different art ?.

The sculpts are unique to this game. However, the ISF release was preceded by a separate expansion just for Iden Versio herself. It's a different pose (and has the unit leader's pauldron) but is otherwise identical to the ISF sculpts that came out later - including the TD details.

Iden on the left below, and an unfinished ISF Trooper painted in Inferno colours on the right.

 

 

[RAIDER[COTG]]

I will say @tipperaryred Im rooting for you. I personally was never a fan of the red, but an all black version w a helmet that doesnt look like a bobble head is up my alley.

If drafting a CRL based mostly off previous ones can be done, Id say do the draft and make the minor adjustments and then give it a shot!

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

37 minutes ago, RAIDER said:

I will say @tipperaryred Im rooting for you. I personally was never a fan of the red, but an all black version w a helmet that doesnt look like a bobble head is up my alley.

If drafting a CRL based mostly off previous ones can be done, Id say do the draft and make the minor adjustments and then give it a shot!

I'll draft up some CRL text when I get a chance, using Iden's, Del's and some amendments. Will be worth a shot!

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Imperial Special Forces trooper – case for CRL approval

Quote

 

Imperial Special Forces
Imperial special forces units are masters of infiltration, extraction, and combat in any environment.  Ruthless warriors and trained pilots, they stand ready to protect – or bury – the Empire's secrets and eliminate any threat to its reign.

( Imperial Special Forces unit description, Inferno Squad expansion, Star Wars: Legion, published in 2020 by Fantasy Flight Games).

 

“Imperial Special Forces” were introduced in the 2020 “Inferno Squad” unit expansion to the licensed tabletop miniatures game “Star Wars: Legion”, published first by Fantasy Flight Games and now Atomic Mass Games.  Unlike some other tabletop games which contain a mix of both Canon and Legends material, Star Wars: Legion operates purely within the current Canon.  It identifies three variants of this force; “Imperial Special Forces unit leader”, “Imperial Special Forces trooper”, and “T-21 Special Forces trooper”.  The game, its unit description, its detailed 3D sculpts and its artwork identifies Inferno Squad as a sub-unit of these Imperial Special Forces:
 

Quote

 

Imperial Special Forces
Inferno Squad
Tasked with protecting the secrets of the Empire by silencing any who would reveal them, Inferno Squad is a special forces unit led by the brilliant commander Iden Versio.  Inferno Squad has proved itself in stealth missions, retrieving vital intelligence, and eliminating key targets.  Among the elite rank of the Imperial special forces, Inferno Squad is particularly notorious for its unconventional tactics, but its efficacy is undeniable.

( Inferno Squad unit description, Inferno Squad expansion, Star Wars: Legion, published in 2020 by Fantasy Flight Games).

 

All unnamed (generic) sculpts in the expansion can be used interchangeably as members of either “Inferno Squad” or as a different but unnamed teams operating under the umbrella term of “Imperial Special Forces”.  At the same time, the sculpts perfectly replicate the details of pre-existing Inferno Squad reference images, including our own CRLs.  The artwork makes clear that the only different between Inferno and ISF kit is the colour schemes and unit insignia displayed.

One element of the costume not visible in the colour artwork is the thermal detonator.  However, as it is an exact match to the thermal detonator featured on the Iden sculpt, and that all other black costume components from any of the current Inferno CRLs remain black in the ISF artwork, it does not seem an unreasonable stretch that this one costume component follows the same rules and can be treated as an exact replica of Iden's own thermal detonator.

The only universal Inferno element (common to all 3 current CRLs) that is not clearly visible in the artwork or sculpts is the compad.  Star Wars: Legion uses a “hero” scale that marginally increases the relative size of heads and hands in relation to the rest of the body.  As a result, the gloves appear to come up nearly to the elbow, obscuring the normal location for the compad.  This is true for the ISF sculpts, and all of the named Inferno sculpts.  Therefore, as a stylistic change, this will hopefully not undermine the assumption that the Inferno style compad is present for all ISF troopers.

For the purpose of this submission, we would like to propose a CRL for the “Imperial Special Forces trooper”.  If approved, we would then be happy to submit the other two variants as well.  The ISF trooper unit has a virtually identical base costume to those seen in existing Inferno CRLs.  Excluding the colour scheme, the trooper has an identical helmet, balaclava, flight suit, gloves, armour, holster and boots to those in all three of the existing Inferno CRLs.  The ammo belt and thermal detonator are identical to those that feature in Iden's CRL, right down to the greebles on the detonator.  The chest box and hoses are also available as optional extras to each model, as in the CRLs.

We would therefore propose submitting a CRL for approval using the existing text from the current approved Inferno CRLs, with the following cosmetic differences that are clearly visible (see images #1 and #2) in the licensed box and leaflet art:

• Instead of red Inferno Squad insignia, the ISF trooper displays white Imperial cog shoulder patches.
• Instead of the red Inferno Squad insignia and red Imperial cog on the front of the helmet, the ISF trooper has two white Imperial cogs.  One piece of artwork (image #3) does show a white variant of the Inferno Squad insignia on the right side of the helmet, but there there does not seem to be enough supporting material to make a case for this as an option.
• There are no red markings or lenses on the ISF trooper helmet.
• There is no red stripe on the right side of the ISF trooper flight suit.

Proposed CRL elements:

• Helmet – as per Del Meeko CRL, with cosmetic colour changes.  Clearly visible in both 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• Balaclava – generic black balaclava visible in artwork (#1 and #2).
• Flightsuit – as per Del Meeko CRL, with cosmetic colour changes.  All matching details clearly visible in 3D sculpts, with colour changes easily seen in artwork (#1 and #2).
• Patches – two white Imperial cog shoulder patches, as seen in artwork (#1 and #2).
• Compad – as per Del Meeko CRL.  Cannot be seen in artwork or sculpts due to oversized hands/gloves covering the compad location.  Is equally true for unique Inferno sculpts from the same game, so replicating compad details from Inferno does not seem unreasonable for a “realistic” scale CRL.
• Gauntlet Gloves – as per Del Meeko CRL.  Can be seen clearly in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• Armour – as per Del Meeko CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• Ammo Belt – as per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).  Also a perfect match to that of the unique Iden Versio sculpt for Star Wars: Legion.
• Holster – as per Del Meeko CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• Thermal Detonator – as  per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details and greebles in 3D sculpts, and a perfect match to that of Iden's unique sculpt.  Colour cannot be seen in colour artwork, but there is no reasonable cause to assume any deviation.
• Boots - as per Del Meeko CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• OPTIONAL – Hoses and Chest Box as per Del Meeko CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).
• OPTIONAL – E-11 Blaster.  Requires further examination for exact match.  Appears to have a tactical flashlight clipped to the outside right of the barrel.

Image #1

Image #2

Image #3

 

 

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

On 8/16/2022 at 11:24 PM, RAIDER said:

Typically @tipperaryred it is in reverse…where action figures (in this case the miniatures) get disregarded, not the art.  That being said, consistency over 25 years on whats done hasnt been the best.  The question I have…is there enough art to support a CRL and build (front back sides) OR will the LMOs allow the use of the miniatures to “fill in gaps” that art doesn’t give such as the back?

I think that this is the most important consideration in the argument for inclusion.

Here is my summary review of what has been discussed so far:

• The tabletop game expands on information we learned from Battlefront II; up until now we are only aware of Inferno Squad which is a commando unit within the Imperial Special Forces.
• We have several new references to draw from:
  • One illustration art work depicting an ISF Unit Leader and two ISF Troopers.
  • Pictures capturing the miniatures for both Inferno Squadron commander Iden Versio (evidenced by TL50 Blaster) and an ISF Trooper.
  • Instructional pictures and artwork for the following characters:
    • Imperial Special Forces Unit Leader
    • Imperial Special Forces Trooper
    • T-21 Special ForcesTrooper 
• There are some minor inconsistencies between the illustration and the instuctional pictures
  • Differences?
• Preliminary discussion of the references indicates that there are some shared characteristics between existing CRLs for the Inferno Squadron with the following exceptions:
  • Instead of the red Inferno Squad insignia and red Imperial cog on the front of the helmet, the ISF trooper has white insignia
    • Figurine has two imperial cogs
    • Illustration has white Inferno Squad and assumed matching white Imperial Cog
  • No red accents at all (stripes, insignias etc)
  • Lenses are standard black/smoke (are we to assume this? Or is it like the Inferno Lens but black instead of red?)
• Imperial Special Forces Trooper  the baseline character can be Del Meeko with additional parts from Iden Versio:
  • Ammo Belt – as per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).  Also a perfect match to that of the unique Iden Versio sculpt for Star Wars: Legion.
  • Thermal Detonator – as  per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details and greebles in 3D sculpts, and a perfect match to that of Iden's unique sculpt.  Colour cannot be seen in colour artwork, but there is no reasonable cause to assume any deviation.

• Imperial Special Forces Unit Leader  the baseline character can be Del Meeko? with additional parts from Iden Versio:
  • Ammo Belt & Thermal Detonator as per above
  • Pauldron - Iden?
  • Anything else?

• T21 Special Forces Trooper  the baseline character can be Del Meeko? with additional parts from Iden Versio and Hask:
  • Ammo Belt & Thermal Detonator as per above
  • Pauldron - Iden?
  • Bandolier/ammo belt - Hask?
  • Anything else?

Please check all items in RED as I would like to have a full understanding here.

One concern I have with these characters is that from a layman's perspective, without the red accents (especially if you use the imperial cogs on the helmet) it looks like a TIE Pilot with some additional items like a different blaster, pauldron, ammo belts and thermal detonator. I would therefore make the case to use the insignia on the helmet in the illustration to distinguish between both TIE Pilots and Imperial Special Forces.

We would like the LMO team to assess if we can create a new set of CRLs based on the three sources; Existing Inferno Squadron CRLs, Illustration from the game and the remains references coming from the Instructional Pictures

Let me know if I missed anything else

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Thanks a million Mark.  Your text below, with your questions answered in red and new clarifications added in green:

• The tabletop game expands on information we learned from Battlefront II; up until now we are only aware of Inferno Squad which is a commando unit within the Imperial Special Forces.
• We have several new references to draw from:
  • One illustration art work depicting an ISF Unit Leader and two ISF Troopers.
  • Pictures capturing the miniatures for both Inferno Squadron commander Iden Versio (evidenced by TL50 Blaster) and an ISF Trooper.  Pictures can also be taken of sculpts for T-21 Special Forces Trooper and Imperial Special Forces unit leader.
  • Instructional pictures and artwork for the following characters:
    • Imperial Special Forces Unit Leader
    • Imperial Special Forces Trooper
    • T-21 Special Forces Trooper 
• The card illustration has some minor inconsistencies compared to the box/leaflet art and the 3D sculpts:
  • Illustration shows white Inferno insignia on right side of helmet (box/leaflet art show white Imperial cog).  Left side of helmet cannot be seen, nor can the shoulder patches.
  • Illustration does not show the expected flight suit pockets that can be found on Inferno flight suit.  All expected pockets are clearly visible on the box/leaflet art and the 3D sculpts.
  • Unit leader in illustration has a smooth shoulder pauldron, unlike the ridged Inferno pauldron that appears in the box/leaflet art, the 3D sculpts, and on Iden Verio.  The illustrated pauldron also looks a little smaller than previously known Imperial pauldrons.
  • Illustration shows two new arm pouches which are not familiar.  These are not featured in the box/leaflet art or on the 3D sculpts.
• Preliminary discussion of the references indicates that there are some shared characteristics between existing CRLs for the Inferno Squadron with the following exceptions:
  • Instead of the red Inferno Squad insignia and red Imperial cog on the front of the helmet, the ISF trooper has white insignia
    • Figurine and box/leaflet art has two imperial cog shoulder patches, also white.
    • Illustration has white Inferno Squad and assumed matching white Imperial Cog.  Also, shoulder patches would have to be assumed to be white Inferno.
  • No red accents at all (stripes, insignias etc)
  • Lenses are standard black/smoke (The modelled helmet is identical for Inferno and for ISF, so I would propose the same rules apply.  IE.  Lvl1 can be flat or bubbled, Lvl2 must be bubbled and mesh backed).
  • As a general rule, it seems any red markings or textures from Inferno revert to the base black for Imperial Special Forces, while any red decals or patches revert to white.
• Imperial Special Forces Trooper  the baseline character can be Del Meeko (minus shoulder pouch, tactical vest, scout belt, scout pouches and thermal detonator) with additional parts from Iden Versio:
  • Ammo Belt – as per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details in 3D sculpts and artwork (#1 and #2).  Also a perfect match to that of the unique Iden Versio sculpt for Star Wars: Legion.
  • Thermal Detonator – as  per Iden Versio CRL.  Can be clearly seen with all matching details and greebles in 3D sculpts, and a perfect match to that of Iden's unique sculpt.  Colour cannot be seen in colour artwork, but there is no reasonable cause to assume any deviation.
  • Gideon Hask's chest bandolier is available as an optional extra.

• Imperial Special Forces Unit Leader  the baseline character can be Del Meeko (as above) with additional parts from Iden Versio:
  • Identical to "Imperial Special Forces Trooper" as outlined above.
  • Pauldron - As per Iden Versio, but all in black.  3D sculpts and box/leaflet art show a ridged pauldron, identical to Iden's.  Card illustration shows a smaller smooth pauldron that is not replicated elsewhere.
  • No other differences.

• T21 Special Forces Trooper  the baseline character can be Del Meeko (as above) with additional parts from Iden Versio and Hask:
  • Identical to "Imperial Special Forces Trooper" as outlined above.
  • Adds Bandolier from Gideon Hask.  NB.  This is also available as an optional extra for the ISF Trooper with an E-11, but is essential for the T-21 trooper.
  • No other differences.

One concern I have with these characters is that from a layman's perspective, without the red accents (especially if you use the imperial cogs on the helmet) it looks like a TIE Pilot with some additional items like a different blaster, pauldron, ammo belts and thermal detonator. I would therefore make the case to use the insignia on the helmet in the illustration to distinguish between both TIE Pilots and Imperial Special Forces.  Understood and agreed.  The only obstacle we'll have to clear is that this detail is only visible in the one (slightly inconsistent) card illustration, and we would have to make a logical assumption that it will mirror Inferno in how the other insignia is display - IE.  white Imperial cog on the left side of the helmet and white "Inferno" patches on both shoulders.

We would like the LMO team to assess if we can create a new set of CRLs based on the following sources; Existing Inferno Squadron CRLs, Illustration from a card in the game and the remaining references coming from the Instructional Pictures, box/leaflet art and photos of 3D sculpts.

[Scubacat[TX]]

So I know this might not even be fully close to approval on variations, but these are based on the troopers for the game. Some have some very interesting add ons to them, but mostly stick to the basic design. 
 

[Scubacat[TX]]

I was looking at this site and also saw that there were a cold weather version and a swamp version too? 
 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

7 hours ago, Scubacat said:

So I know this might not even be fully close to approval on variations, but these are based on the troopers for the game. Some have some very interesting add ons to them, but mostly stick to the basic design. 
 

Yeah, sadly unofficial so no use for a potential CRL, but those are some fine models and I need them very soon for my Legion army!

[Scubacat[TX]]

On 4/20/2023 at 3:33 PM, tipperaryred said:

Yeah, sadly unofficial so no use for a potential CRL, but those are some fine models and I need them very soon for my Legion army!

I couldn’t agree more! They look awesome! I plan on getting a few. Lol. 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Just one more note here that may be of relevance:

Atomic Mass Games publish the licensed "Star Wars: Shatterpoint" (SW:S) table top game, which is also getting a licensed and approved Inferno Squad release.  This release similarly features "Imperial Special Forces" troopers as unnamed versions of the Inferno Squad team, in line in appearance and lore with what appeared in "Star Wars: Legion" (SW:L).  All of the artwork and promotional images for this upcoming release show the alternative red markings and insignia (ie. unnamed generic "Inferno"-style troopers) teased in the box artwork from SW:L, but which wasn't shown elsewhere at that earlier release.

If upon submission the LMO team is happy and willing to sign off on the current proposed CRL (ISF Troopers with white markings, based on SW:L artwork), it may subsequently be worth looking at these ISF troopers with red markings as a separate CRL, based on SW:S artwork.

It might therefore be worth considering a consistent naming convention up front.

Perhaps stick with "Imperial Special Forces Trooper" as planned for those with white markings, and if we pursue the red markings later we could go with "Inferno Squad Trooper"?