IAT- CRL amendment discussion

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

We've had a request to amend the CRL for the Imperial Army Trooper.  I will keep this topic open until the end of the month, when it will be closed and discussed by Staff.  Currently CRLs are not being updated due to ongoing maintenance and overhaul issues with the Legion CRL system, so we can discuss, but also have to wait our turn for publising anything.

 

Please see this topic so we do not re-cover ground already discussed.   

 

Reference photos

 

Reference Photos

 

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

As posted, there was a request to amend the CRL for the Imperial Army Trooper, with Blackwatch presenting links to older content and reference photos. I will be monitoring this discussion to discuss the possible changed that the members wanted to change. The post will stay open till the end of the month, so please let us know so we can actively discuss any changes. 

 

Blackskull

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

Wanted to also make sure that the member or members that requested the CRL change, is for only the Imperial Army Trooper, and not IAT Andor? Remember the discussion closes in 13 days counting today and if the change is needed that a good discussion needs to start on the request to change it. 

 

Blackskull

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DWM]]

Specifically, what changes are we talking? I'm a little confused. This is for the comic Imperial Army Trooper, not the Andor one.

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

Yes, the IAT from what I have gathered. I was just coving my basis to make sure it was not mixed up with IAT Andor. So, what I am hearing someone was asking about possible subdued patches and some accessories. If that member would like to elaborate, so we can understand the changes being requested, would be great. 

Remember this discussion ends on June 30th, 2025, and will be closed.  

Blackskull

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

6 days till discussion closes, if anybody has anything to suggest please do so before, the 30th of June. Thank you

Blackskull

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

Be advised 2 days till discussion closed. Thank you.

 

Blackskull

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

Tomorrow will be the last day this discussion is open. If anyone has any questions on any of the IAT costumes, please respond to this email by tomorrow. Thank you 

 

Blackskull

[MbIAT[TX]]

Hello all,

Not sure if I am the member being mentioned asking for CRL additions, but since this is open I'll share a couple ideas I'd like to see included:

#1 - Optional Use of Sidearm/Holster

In several frames IAT can be seen wearing holsters. They are not vehicle crews nor engineers/sappers as they are drawn like IATs. While specific model is not known, a safe assumption would be the SE-14R as that what Sunber carries so the unit is obviously issued them. It is also the most common sidearm in the Empire.

. Cross draw holster

 Cross draw holster

 Strong-side holster

 Strong-side holster

 Strong-side holster

They all seem to be enclosed holsters with a flap over top. I'd assume done in nylon like the rest of their pouches, so something like this or similar:

The trick would be to get one sized for a SE-14R. I suppose Sunber's holster could also be permitted, being in the unit's inventory. Either the standard black leather/leather-like one the officers have which looks similar, or his combat uniform drop leg version (which wouldn't be as shown but the design exists and is in the unit's inventory. 

#2 - Optional Thermal Detonator

 Not a pouch, worn in the same location as TDs are drawn.

 

I have a third one, but ran out of allowable picture space so it'll be added below.

[MbIAT[TX]]

#3 - New Version - IAT Medic

In several frames we see IA personnel without suspenders, making them distinct from the others. I believe they are medics, working off this frame:

Sunber directs the medic to see to the wounded. When you look at it, Sunber is not talking to the stormtroopers or IAT behind him. When the stormtrooper in front of him says he's trained in first aid, in the next frame Sunber tells him to help the medic. The only other person in frame is the suspender-less IA. Hence he's the medic.

Going back we see suspender-less IAs helping/escorting/supporting the general's movement after he's injured, one of them carrying a piece of medical support gear (it's tubes/cables running to the general's wound covering):

   

Also by the Aid Tent we see this suspender-less IA working with some cables, wearing the same belt pouches seen later:

Once combat breaks out, we have clear shots of the suspender-less IAT fighting, the one with the red hair we see identified in the example as the medic (next post).

 

 

[MbIAT[TX]]

      

[MbIAT[TX]]

So Variant elements:

• No suspenders. (defining element)
• Does not have the two front angled pouches other IATs have on their belt. (defining element)
• Wears cap, not helmet. Code cylinder may or may not be present. 
• Belt would have at least two smaller pouches per side. in several shots there seems to also be a low slung pouch on the left-side rear. I would assume these would be minimum requirements, with other pouches allowed like the other variants.
• The ones helping the general have rectangles drawn above the left chest pocket; some sort of identifier, either as a medic or a rank bar?
• Optional TK Belt and E-11.

I have the required items for this variant and can pose for CRL pics if it would help.

I'd love to get feedback and see these three things included in the CRL. Thanks for your time and attention!

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

Thanks Paul. Thsee are great scans. 

lets keep this open. This is someting we had not previousl discussed, and it would give us literally an option, should the LMO allow it. It owuld also remove the annoying suspenders that alway fall down. 

Ive made leather SER14 holsters and I made one backwards one time because I put the pattern down wrong on the leather.  That gives you that crossdraw. 

Seeing the rectangle, we can only make the surmise that you already have regarding this technical trooper. 

What are your thoughts? The word MEDIC in Aurbesh on the patch? We dont see rank bars on anyone in the coveralls, including Lt. Sunber, so my surmise is this is not a rank. 

None of our IATs or Engineers have a pocket to hold code cylinders, and things like cap greeblies seem to be hit or miss.  I personall dont wear them becaues I wear my hat flipped around backwards under my helmet the way I did in the Army. 

I agree with the pouch layout assessment and the hip mounted pouch may be a medic pouch or modern MOLLE IFAK pouch. 

We know officers usually carry M-S power 5 or DL-44 but we are seeing the SER14 series more commonly now for NCOs. 

the medic box is literally just that, a cheap ammo can with tubes and wires. Easy half hour prop as far as Im concerned. 

 

Further thoughts and discussion welcome. 

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

I like the pistol option, with maybe just the NCO's and Officers of course. SR14 are nice. Also, I notice the pouch load outs are different on some of the IAT's

Medic who needs a Medic, I do lol Medic version would be nice add on, to have more than just an IAT. Bacta-Blue Markings:
A key distinguishing feature would be bacta-blue markings on their arms, indicating their medical status within the Surgical Division. 

On the 2nd issue here is what I found:

Based on Star Wars lore, Imperial Army troopers would not typically carry thermal detonators as standard issue equipment. While the Galactic Empire deployed thermal detonators, they were primarily associated with: 
Stormtroopers: Stormtroopers, particularly specialized units like stormtrooper grenadiers, were known to use thermal detonators.
Specialized Units: The thermal detonator trooper unit, an artillery unit, used a mortar device to launch thermal detonators.
Other Imperials: Other Imperial forces, including some officers and special forces like death troopers, might carry them. 
Imperial Army troopers (also called "army regulars") were the standard infantry soldiers and generally relied on blaster rifles, heavy weapons, and other standard issue gear. 
In summary, while the Imperial military used thermal detonators, they were not standard issue for all Imperial Army troopers. 

 

Paul some great ideas and I hope the discussion goes further. Blackskull. 

[Beau Thacker[CMD-DCA]]

As stated, the discussion will stay open for others to weigh in on these suggestions. 

 

BlackSkull

[MbIAT[TX]]

Thanks for the feedback everyone.

 

@Blackwatch

• We do see medical personnel within the Aid Tent with Rank Tabs, so there is medical-oriented precedence, but I agree that we don't see them on coveralls specifically:
• 
• I think a Medic (in Aurabesh) nametape would be a cool idea, with the precedence being the Sapper's Aurabesh tab.
• I was typing too quick - I meant may or may not have hat greeblies.
• While that below the belt slung pouch could easily be the snowtrooper-style in olive drab, as this CRL utilizes more modern nylon pouches throughout I agree it is likely the same style.
• Yeah, easy prop that can be greeblied up to heart's content.

 

@Beau Thacker

• While I would love to see the Imperial Surgical Division patch used (even if we'd have to find someone to produce it), it does look the patch is green in the frames. Maybe the "Medic nametape" could be bacta blue to tie that color in? But as it blends with the jumpsuit perhaps not?
•          
• Great lore info! I agree that TDs wouldn't be standard issue for IATs, but we see in the ambush scene in issue on pages 34/35 that Sunber uses a mass TD attack on the incoming enemy. A wider shot of his trenchline shown on page 35 second frame shows two IATs (left and right flanks, the right one incidentally armed with an SE-14R interestingly enough) also involved in that battle line so isn't it fair to assume they would also have had TDs? I would infer that in this battle, as casualties mounted, everyone just grabbed whatever gear they could to fight the enemy. The IATs are fighting side by side with TKs, and regulations and TOEs be damned on the frontlines. That's why I would say it could be optional, related to what was available and seen in this specific battle. Just a thought.

 

Looking forward to hearing other's thoughts! 

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

Paul

your patch workup is interesting. Do we have any other views of the comic scans that would support it being any different than the standard patch. My thought this morning would be the medic logo  on the side of the box with the tubes and wires coming out. i can cut those all day on my cricut and vinyl. 

We dont generally get too far off with what we dont know, the one case where we did was with the sappers and my wife embroidered the sapper tabs on her machine with a standard aurbesh typface converted to a SVG file that her machine reads. Now I would do it in vinyl and heat press it saving a step.  There we departed from the "this is known" 

Im goign out in the weeds here myself but what Im thinking is something like this

 

-------------------------------

%     MEDIC

---------------------------------

 

Anway Id love to get more input. Personally I see no reason not to include a somewat simpler variant of the Army trooper, Im sure CO dont exist in the lore but someone had to be trained to keep a trooper alive.  We already have the medic mudtrooper CRL established and the comics predate that as precedent.  hell a bunch of us have the Eduardo Groult inspired Medic Trooper armor, we dont have any markigns other than the green stripe up and over the top and back down, but we do wear green coveralls under the TK armor. If you havent seen them, they are different for sure. 

Paul would you mind punching up a CRL proposal using what we already have for the soft / cap version of the IAT as a reply to this topic? we have a lot of proposals being posted now, and Id want to keep things streamlined. 

[MbIAT[TX]]

@Blackwatch I can't take any credit for the patch; I found it online, apparently from the Star Wars roleplaying game. https://star-wars-roleplaying.fandom.com/wiki/Imperial_Surgical_Division  Not sure if it's considered Canon or not. There are a bunch of different Divisions, each one using the IA background in different colors. Like I mentioned, likely in the comics it's the standard green IA patch.

 

I'm doing the Edouard Groult Medic Trooper myself, sadly not for the 501st but another club/detachment that focuses on those. Wish we could get 501st approval for that one as it is so cool looking. 

 

Sure, I can punch up a proposal for an IAT Medic this week and attach it here.

[MbIAT[TX]]

Evening,

Please see my thoughts below. 

• Comments in Orange
• New items/descriptions in Blue

 

Version – 3 – Imperial Army Medic 

Required Costume Components

The following costume components are present and appear as described below.

Hat, Olive            No changes from existing CRL requirements

Green Imperial Flight Suit     

• One-piece olive green coverall / jumpsuit / flight suit with a front invisible zipper and mandarin collar.
• Each shoulder has a patch as noted below.
• Left chest has a nametape as noted below.
• 2 large chest pockets.
• 2 large cargo pockets sit on the outside of each leg from around mid-thigh and not extending past the bottom of the knee, with a rectangular flap covering the top.
• There are no leg pockets below the knees.
• Rank bars of any kind are not permitted.
• Pockets may feature gussets.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Mandarin collar is closed by a chevron shaped strap across the neck.
• A single snap is present near the chevron point.
• Snap does not need to be functional.
• Snap should be olive green in color.

Imperial Army Patch         No changes from existing CRL requirements

Medic Nametape

• Nametape is full width of pocket.
  • Option One: Size of a standard American Nametape, 5” wide x 1” tall with ¾” lettering (only).
  • 
  • Option Two: Size of a standard Canadian Nametape, 6” wide x 1” tall with ¾” lettering and branch symbol.
  • 
    •  Branch symbol would likely be in-universe medical symbol:
    • 
• Nametape is approximately ¾” above the pocket flap seam.
  • Based on nametape being 1” tall.
• Nametape says ‘Medic’ in Aurabesh.
  • No specific unit, branch organization, or division is cited, but Sunber calls the character “Medic” so it’s a safe extrapolation. 
  • Other options could include:
    • ‘Medical Corps’ (Stormtroopers are often referred to as being part of the Stormtrooper Corps, so a logical extrapolation)
    • ‘Surgical Division’ (used in the SW RPG)
    • ‘Medical’ (simple)
    • ‘MED’ (quick recognition duty Identifier)
    • ‘Army Medic’ (short for Imperial Army Medic)

Discussion Point: As nametape is not seen in detail, either Options One or Two are both possible. Etsy has several options at 5” x 1” with Aurabesh lettering, so it may be the easiest for most people to source. To standardize at that size would seem easiest, but there wouldn’t be an option (or space) to add a in-universe medical symbol.

Olive Gloves            No changes from existing CRL requirements

Belt

• Belt is a nylon military style quick release web belt.
• Belt is olive green in color.
• Belt buckle is olive green in color. (moved from Level 2 to Level 1)

Discussion Point: Eyelets are not seen in the source material, but I don’t have an issue with Level 1 allowing them if we want (saves costumers getting additional belts). However, I’d suggest for Level 2 they not be allowed.

Belt Pouches

• Belt pouches are olive green in color and should be made of nylon or similar material.
• At a minimum, 4 small pouches and one medium pouch are required:
  • Four small pouches should be placed in front - Two on each side of the belt buckle starting ~1-2” away from the buckle. 
    • These pouches have a curved front flap similar in appearance to a compass pouch or grenade pouch.
    • 
  • One medium pouch on left side to the rear. This pouch is slung low, with the top of the pouch wholly below the belt line.
    • While not seen in full, it appears to be rectangular and box-like and have a flap closure about ½ the height of the pouch similar in appearance to a SAW Pouch.
    • 
    • Discussion Point: Dropping a SAW pouch that distance would require a MOLLE drop panel or creative solutions. An alternate option would be to use the more commonly available Snow Trooper pouch, which is designed to hang below the belt,  in olive green instead.
  • Discussion Point: As other pouches are not seen to be carried, it is inferred that these required pouches would likely contain core medical supplies gear. No symbols are specifically seen, but especially on the medium pouch the flap isn’t seen so it is conceivable. I wouldn’t take issue with someone wanting to put one of the in-universe medical symbols on the pouch(es) to reinforce the concept.
• Any additional OD green MOLLE style pouches are permitted to fill out the belt, but are not required.
• Pouches with zippers shall have the zippers covered or concealed either with a matching fabric or tight weave webbing.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Four pouches to the front have olive green snap closures
• All pouches appear to be full.

Boots                No changes from existing CRL requirements

Discussion Point: Boots are not seen in source material for this version, but without evidence saying otherwise it is safe to surmise that they would be the same boots worn by all other IAT variants.

Optional Accessories

Items below are optional costume accessories. These items are not required for approval, but if present appear as described below. If adding in an accessory after initial approval, the item still needs to be submitted to local GML for approval before use.

• TK Ammo Belt        No changes from existing CRL requirements
• E-11 Blaster            No changes from existing CRL requirements
• DH-17 Blaster        No changes from existing CRL requirements
• E-11 Holster           No changes from existing CRL requirements

Medical Equipment

Several pieces of medical equipment are seen in the source art, specifically:

• Crutches
• Casts
• Slings
• Wound dressings
• Medical support equipment (box carried to support the General’s care)
• Surgical equipment and support machinery in Aid Tent

Discussion Point: Do we want to CRL each and every one of these things, or let people be creative if they want with in-universe medical gear? Or just focus on the one box as a character carries it? Or just skip talking about these additional items and consider them props as opposed to costume elements?

 

Look forward to hearing your thoughts!