Force Unleashed Jumptrooper CRL Discussion

[Fivezero[TX]]

Can do! Will try to get them taken tomorrow. If not tomorrow then will I get them this weekend for sure! 

[Fivezero[TX]]

@IcyTrooper Uploaded a few more pics of the jet pack, let me know if you need anything retaken!

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Great job everyone, I'm reviewing the final text and I'd like to start with the helmet, keep in mind I try to look at these things from a "beginners mindset" and how it would relate to choosing armor and building it. I think there is some complexity to this helmet that may benefit from some infographics as well. Also I don't see weathering mentioned anywhere and this costume appears to be quite heavily weathered.

Quote

• The valleys on each side of the helmet are painted black.

I am interested to understand what this means. Are these some kind of patterned indentations on the sides of the helmet? And if so what are the indentations and where are they? How do we know what is a "valley" on the helmet? Is this specific to the kit, or the build or both? Just some clarification as when I am looking at the pics, it's not immediately obvious what I am looking for.

 

Quote

• A gray stripe runs below the lens. This can be painted or a decal.

Is this the thin grey "rim" that runs around the outside of the lens? If so it appears that the grey also extends to the top of the visor. If my understanding is correct we should change this to read like:

"A grey stripe runs around the lens and widens along the top to meet the brow, this can be painted or a decal"

This leads me to the next part, there is no brow mentioned so maybe add:

"The brow is black and raised which the visor rests on"

Quote

• The nostrils are black in color.

I think this may need some work, I would suggest:

"There are two black "nostrils" present that are small rounded rectangle recesses on the bridge of the faceplate, located between and slightly above the lower part of the visor eyes."

Quote

• The ears feature two black pointed details. These can be either hand painted or decals.

I think we should explain that they are round (apart from the overlap with the power cell housing) and sit in the black recessed area shown in the pic

 

Quote

• The "power cells" (boxes sticking out from the cheeks) consist of two smaller boxes with rounded corners and recessed at the top. A black stripe runs around each of the smaller boxes. The power cell housings are recessed for the power cells and feature gray stripes running around them.

I think this text could use some work.

"The power cell is comprised of 3 components; 2 power cells and the power cell housing. The power cells are small rectangular boxes that are connected to the power cell housing, have a recessed face that is black with a black stripe approximately X/X inch wide runs around the outside towards the top of each cell. The power cell housing is seamlessly connected to the cheeks and has a matching white recessed area where the power cells connect, the inner wall of the recessed area is black and also has a black stripe approx X/X inches wide near the top of the housing" (My text is rubbish too, but lets figure this out so it's simple, I think backed with the pic below it will be great!)

I would back this with some infographics in the gallery like this:

Quote

• The aerators are tan, and screening must be silver.
  • The interior of the aerator can either be white or tan.

Looking at the pics the aerator doesn't look tan, more metallic that looks weathered?

Quote

• A red stripe is offset to the left side of the helmet and runs towards the rear of the dome. The stripe is approximately 1/2” (13mm) wide.

Should mention that it's weathered? Not sure if the same effect can be achieved via decal?

Quote

• The visor is attached with gray domed fasteners in the middle of the front traps. The visor attachment tab should be slightly smaller than the traps allowing the traps to be partially visible.
  • The visor has gray stripes on each side, running horizontally from the rear and stopping short of the front.
  • Red symbols similar to the dome symbols are present on each side with a red bar offset. On the left side, the bar is positioned at the rear of the visor. On the right side, the bar is positioned at the front of the visor. Somehow this didn't get copied over in the first post.

That text will need to be removed

Quote

• The hose port is gray in color with a red stripe approximately 3/4" (20mm) wide running down the front.

Red stripe should be weathered

 

That concludes my first run at the helmet, 

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Shoulder Straps

Quote

 

• These shall be securely mounted in front and may free float in the back. They can be affixed with Velcro or adhesive.
• These are white in color with the two front raised details being painted black.

 

Maybe change to:

• Are white in color with a series of approximately 15, evenly spaced raised rectangular features. 
  • The two front rectangular features are black with one being larger than the other.
• Shall be securely mounted in front and may free float in the back. They can be affixed with Velcro or adhesive.

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Shoulder Armor

Quote

• One on each shoulder, flat black in color, featuring 26 holes that are approximately 1” (25mm) in diameter.
  • The holes are arranged in 6 columns with four holes in the first two and last two columns and 5 holes in the two center columns.
  • The holes can be equally spaced from each other.
• The shoulder bells are considered effectively symmetrical. They can be worn interchangeably on the left and right shoulders.
• Shoulders have a 2” (50mm) gray elastic strap that wraps around the inside of the bicep.

to

• Shoulder bells are flat black in color, symmetrical and feature 26 equally spaced recessed circles that are approximately 1” (25mm) in diameter.
• Recessed circles are comprised of 6 columns with 5 recessed circles in the 2 center columns and 4 recessed circles in the remaining columns
• A 2” (50mm) gray elastic strap wraps around the inside of the bicep.

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Biceps

Quote

• Biceps are white in color.
• Biceps feature a cog design, with 8 rectangular protrusions.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• There shall be a return edge that is present with a maximum width of 3/8" (10mm) width.

 

• Biceps are white, fully enclosed and have 8 evenly spaced rectangular boxes

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• There shall be a return edge that is present with a maximum width of 3/8" (10mm) width.

With regards to the L2 here, is this just to ensure that there is some kind of thickness? What if this is 3D printed and there is no return edge? 

•  

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Quote

• Forearms are fully sealed and closed.
• Forearms are white in color.
• Two flat, raised ridge approximately 1” (25mm) wide are present around the forearm.

• Forearms are white and fully enclosed.
• Two flat, raised ridge approximately 1” (25mm) wide are present around the forearm.

[Fivezero[TX]]

Hey @nanotek, that all looks great to me! Overall, I'm not much of a writer so I'm completely open to suggestions.  I'll respond with the Helmet in this post and move to the other parts in my next post. Overall great points and some good catches. Agreed that this helmet has a lot going on, so if there's any additional pictures I should take let me know and I'll get them taken.

 

1. Yes, obviously all of the armor is weathered as you noted. There is a blanket statement at the beginning of the CRL, should we add other references?

"The armor parts are gloss white and weathered, made from one of these (or similar) types of materials:"

 

2. So the "valleys" are the black stripes running around the sides of the helmet, around the ears and cheeks. They are physically inset in the sculpt (about 5mm). This is present on the 3D model from the game. Pictures below, hope they help. If we need to find another term or reword it, I'm all for it.

 

3. That gray stripe is what you're seeing around the lens. From looking at it dynamically in-game, the helmet just under the brow trim seems to match the rest of the helmet (white), with the way light reacts to it. So that's why I kept the gray under the lens and didn't extend it to completely around the lens/meet the brow trim. The weathering/low resolution texture complicates things. It's tough but my vote is to keep the gray under the lens from what I'm seeing.

Good catch on the brow trim!

 

4. Nostrils - agreed, I like what you wrote

 

5. Ears - How about this?

"Ears are rounded with a notch to fit around the power cell housing.

• The ears feature two black pointed details. These can be either hand painted or decals."

 

6. Power Cells - So just a little background, I call them "power cells" because the actual in-game troopers have blue electrical effects (it might just be on the EVO Trooper, but it's the same detail on both helmets). Anyway here's my attempt:

"The power cell is comprised of 3 components; 2 power cells and the power cell housing.

• The power cells are small rectangular boxes that are connected to the power cell housing. Each power cell has a recessed face that is black. A black stripe approximately 3/32" (2mm) wide that runs around the outside of each power cell. There is a small gap between each power cell when mounted in the power cell housing.
• The power cell housing is seamlessly connected to the cheeks and has a recessed area where the power cells mount, the inner wall of the recessed area is black. A gray stripe approx 3/16" (5mm) wide near the top of the housing." Yes it is gray, the weathering darkened it up a lot...

 

7. Aerator/Mic Tips - In game, there is not a lot of detail at all for these over than some beige/tan coloring and a hint of a mesh texture. So I created a simple aerator to house the mesh and painted it tan, much of it gets lost to the heavy weathering in this area. The interior is that same color (not weathered of course). 

8.  Red Stripes - Would this fall under the blanket statement at the beginning? I've got not problem adding it or maybe amending that statement to emphasize the weathering on this trooper.

Also I'm sure someone could replicate the weathering with a decal, would just need some graphic design time so I hate to limit someone, but painting is far easier in my opinion...

 

9. Visor - Yep, agreed that shouldn't be there, good catch!

 

Let me know what you guys think! I will update the Helmet text if we are in agreement.

 

[Fivezero[TX]]

Moving on to the other armor parts now.

Shoulder Straps - I'm good with the rewrite!

Shoulders - Also good with it!

Biceps - Also good with the update!

In regards to the L2 requirement, yes that is mostly just to ensure there is some thickness there. See picture below of my bicep model, the thickness between the green highlighted edges. Maybe return edge isn't the best term here? Maybe something like this?

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• The inner ring of the bicep is approximately 3/16" (5mm) thick.

If someone has a better way to word that, let me know. Also noticed the dimensions were wrong when I looked at my model.

 

Forearms - And finally I like it.

Again if we're all in agreement, I will update the first post with the changes.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

I'll jump in on this when I have a free moment (from training in TX). Just keep in mind, any adjustments that we make need to be reflected on the first page of this with the text that we are pushing to the CRL WIP on the Legion server. I'd HIGHLY recommend that we do parts one at a time, please.

In the immediate, yes there should be mention about weathering and it should be noted in the start of the CRL and state that all parts are consistently weathered unless specified otherwise.

[Fivezero[TX]]

So to keep things rolling, here's the proposed update for the helmet and the new weathering language. All updates are in red below. If we are in agreement, I will update the first post.

 

Special Notes:

• The armor parts are a combination of primarily gloss white and flat black parts, made from one of these (or similar) types of materials:
  • Fiberglass
  • ABS (Acrylonitrile Butadiene Styrene)
  • HIPS (High Impact Polystyrene)
  • PLA, ABS, PETG (3D Printing)
  • Polyurethane Rubber
• Armor is moderately weathered. All red striping must be weathered.
• Blasters are not required for legion membership per our weapons policy
• 3D Printed parts are permitted but all print lines and other artifacts must be removed.

Helmet

• Single piece lens must be sufficiently dark enough to obscure the costumer's eyes. It can be either flat or bubbled. Acceptable colors are black, smoke or dark green.
• A gray stripe runs below the lens and ends at the top of the lens. This can be painted or a decal.
• There are two black "nostrils" present that are small rounded recesses on the bridge of the face, located between and slightly above the lower part of the visor eyes.
• The frown must have 4 to 6 teeth cut out and any gray coloring must not leave the indented area.
  • Black mesh must be used to obscure the face of the wearer.
  • The indents at the bottom of the frown are black.
• The valleys that run from the "cheeks" to the "ears" on each side of the helmet are painted black.
• The lower tube stripes are gray in color and number 4 per side. These can be either hand painted or decals. The tube stripes connect to longer stripes running to the rear of the helmet and curve up to meet with the valleys.
• The upper cheek on each side features 2 vertical black bars that are rounded at the top. The rear bar is slightly taller than the front.
• The "ears" are rounded details with a notch to fit around the power cell housing.
  • The ears feature two black pointed details. These can be either hand painted or decals.
• The power cell is comprised of 3 components; 2 power cells and the power cell housing.
  • The power cells are small rectangular boxes that are connected to the power cell housing. Each power cell has a recessed face that is black. A black stripe approximately 3/32" (2mm) wide that runs around the outside of each power cell. There is a small gap between each power cell when mounted in the power cell housing.
  • The power cell housing is seamlessly connected to the cheeks and has a recessed area where the power cells mount, the inner wall of the recessed area is black. A gray stripe approx 3/16" (5mm) wide near the top of the housing.
• The aerators are tan, and screening must be silver.
  • The interior of the aerator can either be white or tan.
• Traps (trapezoids on dome of helmet) are gray and can be hand painted or decals.
• A red stripe is offset to the left side of the helmet and runs towards the rear of the dome. The stripe is approximately 1/2” (13mm) wide.
• Two small red symbols are present next to the dome stripe.
• Brow trim, black and approximately 5/8" (16mm) in height, runs from the rear of one trap to the rear of the opposite trap.
• The visor is attached with gray domed fasteners in the middle of the front traps.  The visor attachment tab should be slightly smaller than the traps allowing the traps to be partially visible.
  • The visor has gray stripes on each side, running horizontally from the rear and stopping short of the front.
  • Red symbols similar to the dome symbols are present on each side with a red bar offset. On the left side, the bar is positioned towards the rear of the visor. On the right side, the bar is positioned towards the front of the visor.
  • Visor mounts in front of the brow trim, with the top of the visor flush with the top of the brow trim.
• The hose port is gray in color with a red stripe approximately 3/4" (20mm) wide running down the front. 

[nanotek[CMD-DWM]]

Hey sorry, been caught up in a lot.

Re: Weathering we usually specify for each piece as evident in Mudtrooper CRL, and it appears to be that some items are more heavily weathered than others. The bottom of the shins, the posterior and kidney for example have slightly heavier weathering that other parts, I think it's worthwhile noting these.

I get concerned about burying weathering in the special notes as it often get's overlooked. I think if we have a phrase that matches something like "weathering is consistent with the photo reference" or similar can help too.

Re: Valleys - cool I get it now, there's a recessed area (approx. 5mm deep where the ears sit, and it continues along the top of the tube(? where the tube stripes are, do we refer to this technically as "the tubes") and terminates at a right angle approximately 2"(?) from the front and 1/4" from the base of the helmet. Don't know really what to call it but maybe something like this:

I think everything is taking shape nicely, thank you for your efforts! I'll get the rest of the team to chime in as well!

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

5 hours ago, nanotek said:

Hey sorry, been caught up in a lot.

Re: Weathering we usually specify for each piece as evident in Mudtrooper CRL, and it appears to be that some items are more heavily weathered than others. The bottom of the shins, the posterior and kidney for example have slightly heavier weathering that other parts, I think it's worthwhile noting these.

I get concerned about burying weathering in the special notes as it often get's overlooked. I think if we have a phrase that matches something like "weathering is consistent with the photo reference" or similar can help too.

Re: Valleys - cool I get it now, there's a recessed area (approx. 5mm deep where the ears sit, and it continues along the top of the tube(? where the tube stripes are, do we refer to this technically as "the tubes") and terminates at a right angle approximately 2"(?) from the front and 1/4" from the base of the helmet. Don't know really what to call it but maybe something like this:

I think everything is taking shape nicely, thank you for your efforts! I'll get the rest of the team to chime in as well!

I think your first description there, "recessed area", is likely to lead to the least confusion. Valleys and channels make sense as terms once you understand what you're looking at, but at first glance could confuse people. Actually, maybe mix the two together:

"A recessed channel (approx 5mm deep) runs around the edge of the ear pieces and the front and top edges of the tube...[can then add in extra details such as measurements, black paint, etc]".

Also, I'd agree it's worth calling attention in individual costume elements to specifics parts of the weathering that stand out in some way.

All else looks good to me on the helmet.

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

All that is written needs to be clear for both the builder, especially a first time builder, and the GML who can, and has happened, interpret things totally differently than the builder or the SME's in this case us. The descriptions above seem to be clearer.  

 

[Fivezero[TX]]

Thanks for the feedback guys! I appreciate it, been a few years since I've written CRLs, definitely more detail nowadays, which isn't a bad thing at all.

Regarding weathering, I have no issue adding it to each individual piece. Personally I feel like we should leave it a little open/broad for L1 and then maybe tighten down to match reference pics for L2.  How about something like this?

• Helmet (or other armor part) is moderately weathered. All red detailing is weathered.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Weathering will match style seen in reference photos.
  • Heavier weathering is present around power cell housings, aerators and hose port.

I feel this is a more consistent with how I've approached most of the L2 requirements for these Force Unleashed troopers, making L2 match exactly what we see in game while keeping L1 more "traditional" for TK-based parts. Just some other L2 examples are 2.5" belt vs. 3-3.5" belt, 9 ab buttons vs. 10, etc.

 

I love the new term for the valleys! Here's the updated text.

• A recessed channel, painted black, runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes.

What do you guys think?

 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

16 hours ago, Fivezero said:

Thanks for the feedback guys! I appreciate it, been a few years since I've written CRLs, definitely more detail nowadays, which isn't a bad thing at all.

Regarding weathering, I have no issue adding it to each individual piece. Personally I feel like we should leave it a little open/broad for L1 and then maybe tighten down to match reference pics for L2.  How about something like this?

• Helmet (or other armor part) is moderately weathered. All red detailing is weathered.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Weathering will match style seen in reference photos.
  • Heavier weathering is present around power cell housings, aerators and hose port.

I feel this is a more consistent with how I've approached most of the L2 requirements for these Force Unleashed troopers, making L2 match exactly what we see in game while keeping L1 more "traditional" for TK-based parts. Just some other L2 examples are 2.5" belt vs. 3-3.5" belt, 9 ab buttons vs. 10, etc.

 

I love the new term for the valleys! Here's the updated text.

• A recessed channel, painted black, runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes.

What do you guys think?

 

I'd definitely agree myself.  Don't want to be going down the Boba/Cpt Rex detail on paintwork/weathering, at least for L1!

As for the channels, maybe add in that they're painted black as before, and Mark's extra detail about where they terminate?

[Fivezero[TX]]

So I've been leaving out detail on this recess, because it terminates in a "crease" where two surfaces are meeting. Not really at a defined measurement from a hard edge. Same goes for other measurements. Width, depth, etc. all vary.

Here's another stab at it, the "painted black" was in the one above, but I threw it in its own section so it doesn't get buried. If we go this, let's rename any instance of "lower tube" to "lower cheek," the lower tube now being the surface below the blue line in the pic below.

• A recessed channel runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes. The channel terminates where the lower cheek meets the lower tube of the helmet.
  • This recess is painted black.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

I think we're getting close, but I'm still not 100% clear on the language translating to the images.  As I look at the reference images, I don't see the channel "terminating" where the tubes meet the cheeks.  What I see instead is that the channel then turns 90 degrees downwards (cutting through the tubes) and terminates near the bottom of the helmet?  If I'm understanding this correctly, then what about:

 

• A recessed channel runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes. When this channel meets the front of the cheek, it turns 90 degrees downwards and bisects the lower tubes.  The channel then terminates near the base of the helmet.
  • This recess is painted black.

I agree about not trying to add in measurements if they vary that much.  Any designer or sculptor would never rely just on CRL text for that level of detail anyway.

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

Looking at it fresh, neither one of the two above in red are clear to me.  So,  to me, the original, which is simpler , is easier for me to understand: In this case tubes=cheeks.

• A recessed channel, painted black, runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes.

[Fivezero[TX]]

I agree with what @Blackwatch wrote. After thinking it over today, I was going to suggest that maybe we were trying too hard to define this channel. It's something inherent to the sculpt, so I don't think we need to get too detailed with it. My original intent was merely to suggest it's there and it's painted black.

If we're all in agreement, I will combine the latest edits for a final review of the helmet before we move on to the next part.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Go with it ?

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

simple is better. 

 

I went through the discussions on the recent proposal to change/update the opspec for CRL verbiage, and it was stated by one person that the CRLS need to be more detailed.  Down to the nth degree.  I have to completely disagree with that, as did the LMO.  CRLs are just a visual and text reference guide, nothing more. Anything else should be directed to our forums where we can but out the micrometers and discuss a build in detail. Ive heard from so many people in the past year that CRLS are getting out of control, and far too involved.     

[Fivezero[TX]]

Alright here we go, had a storm roll through yesterday that knocked out my power, but I'm back. All good discussion here, there's a lot to this helmet, but I think we've got it. Also good because we have two similar CRLs coming (EVO update and new Shadow EVO CRLs) that I will base on the Jumptrooper.

Anyway take a look, if it all looks good I'll update the main post and we'll move to the next piece of armor.

@nanotek After we get through these first few pieces you looked at, I'll turn it back over to you to continue your review.

 

Helmet

• Single piece lens must be sufficiently dark enough to obscure the costumer's eyes. It can be either flat or bubbled. Acceptable colors are black, smoke or dark green.
• A gray stripe runs below the lens ending at the top of the lens. This can be painted or a decal.
• There are two black "nostrils" present that are small rounded recesses on the bridge of the face, located between and slightly above the lower part of the visor eyes.
• The frown must have 4 to 6 teeth cut out and any gray coloring must not leave the indented area.
  • Black mesh must be used to obscure the face of the wearer.
  • The indents at the bottom of the frown are black.
• A recessed channel, painted black, runs around the ears and continues above and across the lower tubes.
• The lower tube stripes are gray in color and number 4 per side. These can be either hand painted or decals. The tube stripes connect to longer stripes running to the rear of the helmet.
• The upper cheek on each side features 2 vertical black bars that are rounded at the top. The rear bar is slightly taller than the front.
• The "ears" are rounded details with a notch to fit around the power cell housing.
  • The ears feature two black pointed details. These can be either hand painted or decals.
• The power cell is comprised of 3 components; 2 power cells and the power cell housing.
  • The power cells are small rectangular boxes that are connected to the power cell housing. Each power cell has a recessed face that is black. A black stripe approximately 3/32" (2mm) wide that runs around the outside of each power cell. There is a small gap between each power cell when mounted in the power cell housing.
  • The power cell housing is seamlessly connected to the cheeks and has a recessed area where the power cells mount, the inner wall of the recessed area is black. A gray stripe approx 3/16" (5mm) wide near the top of the housing.
• The aerators are tan, and screening must be silver.
  • The interior of the aerator can either be white or tan.
• Traps (trapezoids on dome of helmet) are gray and can be hand painted or decals.
• A red stripe is offset to the left side of the helmet and runs towards the rear of the dome. The stripe is approximately 1/2” (13mm) wide.
• Two small red symbols are present next to the dome stripe.
• Brow trim, black and approximately 5/8" (16mm) in height, runs from the rear of one trap to the rear of the opposite trap.
• The visor is attached with gray domed fasteners in the middle of the front traps.  The visor attachment tab should be slightly smaller than the traps allowing the traps to be partially visible.
  • The visor has gray stripes on each side, running horizontally from the rear and stopping short of the front.
  • Red symbols similar to the dome symbols are present on each side with a red bar offset. On the left side, the bar is positioned towards the rear of the visor. On the right side, the bar is positioned towards the front of the visor.
  • Visor mounts in front of the brow trim, with the top of the visor flush with the top of the brow trim.
• The hose port is gray in color with a red stripe approximately 3/4" (20mm) wide running down the front. 
• Helmet is moderately weathered. All red detailing is weathered.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Weathering will match style seen in reference photos.
  • Heavier weathering is present around the power cell housings, aerators and hose port.

 

[Blackwatch[CMD-DCA]]

Ive read this twice, and its clear and understandable, at least to me.  

[Fivezero[TX]]

Alright I'm back! Locking in the helmet text. Moving onto the helmet hose, minor edit to reflect the new weathering text/L2 requirement.

 

Helmet Hose

• Black ribbed hose that is 1.75" (45mm) diameter and 10" to 16" (20-40cm) of length from the helmet hose port to the front chest hose port.
• Hose features a red stripe approximately 3/4" (20mm) wide, centered and running down the front of the hose. The red stripe is weathered.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Weathering will match style seen in reference photos.