New CRL Development - Mud Trooper

[areilly]

7 hours ago, Dragon_a said:

I think the blaster the Range Troopers use is called an E11R.

The E10 is used by Mud Troopers as well as Mimban Stormtroopers

E-10 for the mud troopers, E-10R for the Range Troopers (from the Solo official guide)

[JAFO[TX]]

Apologies for the delay in joining the discussion fully. I’ve been meaning to post for a while but have been busy. 

I’ve now found some time to collect my thoughts and chime in with my stream of consciousness.

First up, any chance we could actually refer to the name Mudtrooper as one word? It’s how all official reference material and production assets state the character.

In regards to the W.I.P CRL the images used so far are questionable. That’s understandable given how early in the day we are and the lack of HiRes public reference imagery. Of the photos currently on show the back plate is certainly incorrect, the shoulder bells don’t look quite right in shape, the lower belt is missing the long box and the boots look too short.

Here’s my thinking based on each of the CRL entries. It is by no means conclusive. Some of the finer detail may be reserved for Lvl 2/3 consideration.

 

HELMET

The detail here relates to specifying the appearance of the code disks: 

A stepped cone shape appearing to be 3 disks stacked on top of one another. The discs are of equal thickness. An indentation appears in the centre of the top disk.

The code disk does not include the "V" shaped groove sometimes found on the two outer discs.

UPDATE. Trim on the helmet is confirmed as rubber. The join is on the back on the helmet in the centre.

GOGGLES

The goggles were never designed to be worn in action. Anecdotal comments from those involved in production state that goggles were never removed from the helmets. The only character seen on film to wear the goggles is Rio. Rio’s style of goggles is different to the standard Mudtrooper goggle and has a more rounded rubber seal.

The goggle detail relates to a few of things…

1. The step-up in elastic size - the strap that joins the goggles is stitched to a larger elastic that forms the band that goes around the back of the helmet. Variance could be 25mm-38mm, or 40mm to 50mm.  Yet to be determined.

2. Goggle strap features large buckle greeble on left side and two black plastic tri-glides on the right rear.

3. The top frame of the goggles shall feature a gold screw-action nose adjuster sourced from Halcyon Mk9 SuperJet goggles.

4. The goggles shall feature angled lenses.

RESPIRATOR

The respirators were not designed to be worn in action. Anecdotal comments from those involved in production state that the respirator was only worn around the neck. The only two characters character seen wearing a respirator in the movie are Rio, and Han – for all of two seconds!

Respirators were suspended around the neck on the end of a 20mm khaki webbing strap that had two D-RINGS at each end. D-RINGS are sourced from the Yugoslav backpack. The D-RINGS attached to the respirator via the carabiner clips also sourced from the Yugoslav backpack. The webbing strap connects to the backplate.

It should also be stated that metal mesh should be present behind the vocoder and the respirator canisters.

BACK PLATE

A couple of points here…

Black foam extends past the arm openings. Same as Shoretrooper, though back only. UPDATE: Whilst unconfirmed the foam is most likely to be 5mm Plastazote, the same as the Shoretrooper and Tank Trooper. 

The back plate should feature two round raised circular sections for the hoses to attach to.

TUNIC

I stand by my previous observations on the tunic – that it is a combination of an Imperial Officer and First Order Officer in design. The seams and cut are comparable.

I believe the colour to be field grey but it’s hard to say exactly WHICH field grey! 

The weave looks to be a heavy wool twill. SW Costume Department has stated it was a heavy wool material.  Anecdotal comments from those involved in production state that the tunics were heavy to wear. They also do not recall any pockets on the tunics, as shown in the Hot Toys version.

PANTS

SW Costume Department has stated that pants were made from a heavy black cotton material. Anecdotal comments from those involved in production state that the pants were thick and heavy to wear, and that many chose to wear braces (button type) to help keep them in place.

Pants have double stitched reinforced thighs - not knees as currently stated.

BOOTS

There appear to be a few types of boots used in production. SW Costume Department has stated many were left over from Rogue One and re-used. 

There is a shot in circulation showing a mid-calf boot with no shins. This is of Rio and should be discounted.

Hero Mudtroopers - such as Han and Val - have a buckle present on the top outside of their boots. Standard Mudtroopers appear to be wearing boots most similar to WW2 Soviet Officer boots. The boot is just below knee height. The leather is smooth and not textured. The boots do not appear to have any tread and anecdotal comments from those involved in production supported this. 

SHINS

Whilst similar to the Shoretrooper shin it should be noted that the straps are both of the same width. Also different is the fact that the knee plates angle out and away from the kneecap.

GLOVES

There are two types of gloves used in production, the first being the Shoretrooper black glove. The other is the Highlander Spec Ops glove as noted.

CAPE

The cape used in production was confirmed by SW Costume Department to be the WW2 era Soviet Plash Palatka which was dyed black prior to weathering.

As noted, the most accurate style of Plash is pre-70s where NO brass grommets are present. In addition, wooden toggles and stitched eyes are present rather than small brass eyelets.

OFFICER BELT

For clarity it should be noted that the two metal boxes are Rogue One Officer style rather than OT Imperial Officer style.

LOWER BELT

I’ve seen nothing to suggest two options for the lower belt. All reference I have seen shows the six boxes in situ. The only variance I have seen is the sequence of the middle four boxes – either Large/Small/Small/Large or Large/Small/Large/Small.

**UPDATE** I knew I'd forget stuff, so here to update. Both belts are kept in place at the rear of the costume. One pic appears to show a drop-down loop - approx. 3-4in in width - from the back plate through which both belts pass. However, another pic suggests the belts could pass through a large belt loop on the rear of the tunic.

SCARF

Mudtroopers are seen to be wearing scarves and at least two types have been sighted so far.  Based on onscreen reference, with the addition of personal behind-the-scenes images of a screen used scarf, the most seen scarf appears to be dark grey in colour. They have an open weave similar in look to hessian/burlap, however, the production source states they were very soft to wear. They were approx.. 52in in length.

UNDERGARMENT

Whilst it won’t form part of the CRL it may be of interest for people to know that the undergarment worn by Mudtroopers during production was a British Army Anti-Static Self Wicking t-shirt in Brown.

AMMO POUCH

So far, the Yugo M49-M56 has been sighted worn in three different – left and right shoulder/chest, and left hip.

BANDOLIER

M855 Post-Vietnam US Army four pocket bandolier.

 

So, there you have it. Like I said, a stream of consciousness. Do with it what you will. I’ll continue to add as I uncover or remember! I appreciate anecdotal evidence doesn’t count but I felt it interesting to share.

There’s no doubt that come the home release of S:ASWS in September we should have more to go on. Not so much from the movie itself but more from any BTS documentaries and featurettes. Here’s hoping!

Finally, here’s a link to an album of pics that will be useful for this CRL. Some are simply better versions of images already posted, others are new:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/150772035@N08/albums/72157697274233291/with/42622196074/

 

[Dragon_a[501st]]

On 7/11/2018 at 12:03 AM, areilly said:

E-10 for the mud troopers, E-10R for the Range Troopers (from the Solo official guide)

I stand corrected ? it is an E10R

[izzi[TX]]

A ton to review! Thanks!

[JAFO[TX]]

22 minutes ago, izzi said:

A ton to review! Thanks!

Pleasure! Shout out if you want clarification on anything.

[izzi[TX]]

Will do!  I have some events to take care of this weekend and with the SW:E trooper on track, we should be digging into this next week.

Thanks so much for sharing.

[JAFO[TX]]

7 hours ago, izzi said:

A ton to review! Thanks!

Some added info confirmed in the last 24hrs...

 

Tunic was made from Olive Grey Denim.

Pants were Cotton, Dyed Black.

The helmet liner - seen in the Val image - was custom made for production rather than bought off shelf.

 

 

[izzi[TX]]

Olive Grey Denim... that'll be fun to find, or dye!

[Torrent[501st]]

55 minutes ago, izzi said:

Olive Grey Denim... that'll be fun to find, or dye!

Hence alternatives.  

[Kobra883]

Awesome notes JAFO...your "observational" skills are going to be very helpful for myself and others when the time comes to assemble this outfit.And a huge thank you for posting those reference photos on your Flickr account .Those are going to be ex-termly helpful when it comes time to assembly.

[Scubacat[TX]]

Olive Grey Denim... that'll be fun to find, or dye!

I say we learn magic to just create our kits with the flick of a wand from now on.

Loving all of this research! Keep up the great work! I keep watching all of the builds out there. I am thinking I might have to make one in the future myself when I get done with my other projects.


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[areilly]

Here's my collection of images - there's a few in there that I don't think have been included in this thread yet.

https://imgur.com/a/ow3WUHi

And I also collected the hi res promo shots of the hot toys 1/6th scale figure. Obviously the toy can't be used as a reference, but it may be useful to fill in gaps where we don't have any other images.

https://imgur.com/a/qeE2SZV

 

[amcclary[TX]]

After building the armor, comparing it against all the photos, here is where we are at and some observations made while wearing the costume to a con. 

First of off this is a fun costume to troop in.  It gets a lot of attention and is comfortable compared to most.  The cloak is also fun.  Beware though that when it hangs down fully people can step on it.  It can be buttoned in an up position, but long term it might be better to modify it so its shorter and doesn't hit the ground. 

There are two main pinch points in this costume.  At the elbo where the biceps meet and on the top of the foot where the shin guards meet.  The biceps pinch when you raise your forearms with the blaster.  The top of your foot gets pinched if you step forward and the shin guard has slipped down. 

We are still working on confirming the exact size of the goggles but we are pretty sure of them.  What we built matches perfectly the high res images we have with our CAD models when we photo matched them in the computer with multiple photos.  Depending on the angle of the camera/lens or where the goggles get worn they can look big.  So we are double checking.  But based on the photos in the visual guide of the troopers, they are large goggles. (See photo of Sharluy Greslin) The same is true of the respirator, but again its large as well.  Much larger than the paint respirators we wear in our shop.  But comparing to the photo of Collum Woslo, it too is very large. The helmet size we are very sure of because we know that a skate like helmet was used on the interior.  We used a basic skate helmet as the inner liner of this helmet and modeled it around it.  Darren has said that this was probably a custom liner, but you can tell from the photo of Val its size is comparable to a basic skate helmet.  

To put the respirator in its up position, we used hooks inside of the helmet and rings on the straps seen at the top of the mask.  This worked pretty well and I am guessing from the photo of Collum Woslo in the guide that this is how its done, though we don't know the exact hooking mechanism because its not seen.  I recommend the hook and ring method because its relatively easy to do and there isn't much room up there for your hands to work fasteners.

[izzi[TX]]

Awesome work. I'm going to be going through all the new images this week and posting to the top any new references or better quality references of the ones we currently have.

I know people have been anxiously waiting for this unit to be approved, but with information and images still being released and gathered, pushing it through has been a bit premature.  Hopefully with all the new collaboration on this unit and the references shared, we'll have what we need to complete at least a base standard for 501st approval and can build from there.

[JAFO[TX]]

We’re around six weeks from home release of SOLO. It might be prudent to wait that little be longer.

[Scubacat[TX]]

After building the armor, comparing it against all the photos, here is where we are at and some observations made while wearing the costume to a con. 
First of off this is a fun costume to troop in.  It gets a lot of attention and is comfortable compared to most.  The cloak is also fun.  Beware though that when it hangs down fully people can step on it.  It can be buttoned in an up position, but long term it might be better to modify it so its shorter and doesn't hit the ground. 

There are two main pinch points in this costume.  At the elbo where the biceps meet and on the top of the foot where the shin guards meet.  The biceps pinch when you raise your forearms with the blaster.  The top of your foot gets pinched if you step forward and the shin guard has slipped down. 
We are still working on confirming the exact size of the goggles but we are pretty sure of them.  What we built matches perfectly the high res images we have with our CAD models when we photo matched them in the computer with multiple photos.  Depending on the angle of the camera/lens or where the goggles get worn they can look big.  So we are double checking.  But based on the photos in the visual guide of the troopers, they are large goggles. (See photo of Sharluy Greslin) The same is true of the respirator, but again its large as well.  Much larger than the paint respirators we wear in our shop.  But comparing to the photo of Collum Woslo, it too is very large. The helmet size we are very sure of because we know that a skate like helmet was used on the interior.  We used a basic skate helmet as the inner liner of this helmet and modeled it around it.  Darren has said that this was probably a custom liner, but you can tell from the photo of Val its size is comparable to a basic skate helmet.  
To put the respirator in its up position, we used hooks inside of the helmet and rings on the straps seen at the top of the mask.  This worked pretty well and I am guessing from the photo of Collum Woslo in the guide that this is how its done, though we don't know the exact hooking mechanism because its not seen.  I recommend the hook and ring method because its relatively easy to do and there isn't much room up there for your hands to work fasteners.

Would there be a way to modify it where the shoe meets the armor to have something inserted underneath to prevent this pinching?


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[amcclary[TX]]

I plan on gluing some black EVA foam just under the point of the shin guard so there is padding there.  I might also be adding some velcro under the straps and putting some on the boot so the shin guard stays up just a bit instead of resting on the foot.  But I am hoping that just adding some foam under it will allow the guard to move without putting a pinch on my foot.

 

[amcclary[TX]]

I put together a page on my studios web site with more photos of my costume and its parts.  http://www.mcclarydesign.com/2018/07/17/mud-trooper-project/

Here are a few photos from the page.

 

[ScaryGuy[501st]]

Nice shiny boots for a mudtrooper ?.

[amcclary[TX]]

3 hours ago, ScaryGuy said:

Nice shiny boots for a mudtrooper ?.

I just haven't had the heart to spray paint them yet.  But it will happen.

[JAFO[TX]]

On 7/16/2018 at 4:49 AM, Kobra883 said:

Awesome notes JAFO...your "observational" skills are going to be very helpful for myself and others when the time comes to assemble this outfit.And a huge thank you for posting those reference photos on your Flickr account .Those are going to be ex-termly helpful when it comes time to assembly.

Pleasure Mike. 

In addition to the notes already left I can confirm that the helmet liner was a custom build by the SW props department. Not a found part.

 

[JAFO[TX]]

Whilst not part of the costume per se I think the CRL should elude to the fact that Mudtrooper faces should look dirty. It's a small thing but something that adds to the overall appearance. Fair to say that all reference pics so far show the MTs to be weathered beyond just the costume!

[JAFO[TX]]

On 7/13/2018 at 1:09 PM, izzi said:

A ton to review! Thanks!

Some added info confirmed in the last 24hrs...

 

**UPDATE**

For what it is worth, production used the UK based company Colorite and the confirmed armour colours are as follows...

Technogrip 350U Green Matt
Technogrip 7535U Grey Satin

 

 

[izzi[TX]]

With all the new references in hand let's push forward. I think I'm going to make this the discussion thread and create a new locked thread to post up the descriptions that we agree on. That being said let's attack this one piece at a time starting with the base layers and working our way out to the armor.  We;re going to start with the pants and tunic. THe pants should be rather easy, but I know the tunic has some disagreements.  Here, we are not pinning down which pants and jackets fit the mold. Rather we are defining what features need to be present for the pants or jacket to pass inspection.

Pants

• Pants are Black BDU/Work pants with double reinforced thighs.
• They do not have pockets or other adornment on the legs.
• Shall be moderately to heavily weathered.

Anything else that needs to be added to the pants?

Tunic/Jacket

• A long-sleeved, Olive Drab or Field Grey, jacket that falls between upper and mid thigh. - (Do we have references for both colors or do we need to choose only one?)
• Shall be moderately to heavily weathered.
• Has a ??? collar. - (I'm assuming a mandarin collar but I can't find an exact reference due to the scarves)
• Has two "flaps" on either side of the front zipper approximately ??? in width. - (Do we have a measurement here?)
• Has a stitched "cuff" on the sleeve approximately ??? in height. - (Every jacket I can see has that stitching up the forearm that is either a cuff or gives the appearance of one. They look to be around 5-6" high to me. What is everyone else's thoughts on this?)
• If pockets are present they are hidden or barely noticable.

Optional Level 2:

• Jacket is made of a heavy wool twill or similar material.
• There is an imperial cog patch sewn on each shoulder.
• No pockets are present on jacket.

Is there anything else that is being missed on the jacket? 

[areilly]

Tunic fabric was confirmed as a olive gray denim. That’s gonna be tough to find in an existing jacket to modify though , so maybe stick with olive drab for level 1? And then the olive gray denim for 2? Olive drab with some gray weathering will probably be pretty close.

I haven’t seen any clear pics of the collar either. Appears to be a stand up collar, open at the front, different from the officer’s typical full mandarin collar. All we’ve really had for the collar is on the toys.

for the zipper I think it’s also mostly guesswork, no clear references that I’ve seen. I’m assuming it’s a hidden zipper style.

The tunics do have pockets - breast pockets that connect to the sleeves, and in one shot there appears to be a basic internal pocket aligned with the waist seam, mostly covered by the belt. I’d agree though that if someone was modifying a field jacket, they would want to remove any pockets that are stiched onto the outside off the jacket.