Imperial Super Commando - Gar Saxon (Rebels - Animated) CRL Discussion

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

I will be looking at the current progress this week, might be Wednesday afternoon/evening before I can dive in. Major thanks to @tipperaryred for leading the way on the text from the CRL team!  

[beren88]

On 5/18/2024 at 5:30 AM, tipperaryred said:

Brilliant work!

Spot on, no issues.

Also great.

Only two issues here that I can see.  First, you don't need to have that raised ridge running around the top (where the white band is on the right forearm).  There is definitely no change in elevation there:

So I think you can scrap that raised ridge entirely and leave it all at the same elevation. 

Second, you can see in some images that the hand plates run underneath the forearm armour:

For this reason, I think having them 3D printed in hard armour would limit movement, and would also cause one or both to break very quickly.  I think you would be safest leaving the forearm as a separate piece, and then making a set of hand plates out of something flexible like foam rubber.  The white triangle is simply painted on, so there is no need to sculpt a raised ridge where the white triangle is.

 

 

i wonder if the armour coming under the gauntlet is just an animation thing.  
Armour in real life doesnt typically do that as it limits wrist movement.

i think the hard armour hand plates is still best option.
I think the armour will just need to be touching the gauntlet for when put on. It might naturally slip under sometimes, btu i think its best to have a 1/4imch gap to create illusion fo coverage, but still allow movement

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

No problem, I'll review the reference images again.  My instinct would be to leave both hand plate options open for builders, but I'll confirm once I've had a chance to review

[MisterxM]

On 5/20/2024 at 9:42 PM, tipperaryred said:

I think we're nearly done on all the major parts, but I'll ask at least one or two of our experienced staff members to do a final review before we finish. It's particularly important to make sure the language and wording is consistent with our other CRLs. Once that is done, we'll then need photos of the final parts, and everything put together.

Thanks for info 👍I asked because I would like to start my build. Some of the files i would like to buy from Beren88 and maybe people from Polish Garrison could help me with the rest of them. But I agree, it's time to check all very thoroughly. So I can wait, no problem 🙂

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

On 5/21/2024 at 4:59 PM, beren88 said:

i wonder if the armour coming under the gauntlet is just an animation thing.  
Armour in real life doesnt typically do that as it limits wrist movement.

i think the hard armour hand plates is still best option.
I think the armour will just need to be touching the gauntlet for when put on. It might naturally slip under sometimes, btu i think its best to have a 1/4imch gap to create illusion fo coverage, but still allow movement

I understand what you mean, but having looked again at the references, I can't find a single frame where there's even the slightest gap between the hand plates and the forearm armour:

Even the conceptual art shows the hand plates sitting much lower and apparently sliding underneath the forearms.  Some of the screens show a definite flex in the hand plates.  You are entirely correct that this could just be an artefact of the animation, but nonetheless it is what is appearing on the screen.  So we have to walk the difficult line between replicating that, while still making it possible for a real human to wear the costume.  If we try and recreate this look purely with hard plastic, I don't see any way that it will be possible for you to move your wrists.

My instinct would be go with something like that wording used in the ANH TK CRL:

"As an alternative to plastic, these may be made out of latex or latex-like material"

If someone can successfully achieve the required look with plastic, there is no problem at all.  But my instinct is that we need to allow a more flexible option in order to balance the right look with the ability to actually move while wearing it.

[beren88]

On 5/24/2024 at 6:25 AM, tipperaryred said:

I understand what you mean, but having looked again at the references, I can't find a single frame where there's even the slightest gap between the hand plates and the forearm armour:

Even the conceptual art shows the hand plates sitting much lower and apparently sliding underneath the forearms.  Some of the screens show a definite flex in the hand plates.  You are entirely correct that this could just be an artefact of the animation, but nonetheless it is what is appearing on the screen.  So we have to walk the difficult line between replicating that, while still making it possible for a real human to wear the costume.  If we try and recreate this look purely with hard plastic, I don't see any way that it will be possible for you to move your wrists.

My instinct would be go with something like that wording used in the ANH TK CRL:

"As an alternative to plastic, these may be made out of latex or latex-like material"

If someone can successfully achieve the required look with plastic, there is no problem at all.  But my instinct is that we need to allow a more flexible option in order to balance the right look with the ability to actually move while wearing it.

im not being argumentative. Im just concerned about the handplates given the fact the the animation is showing them benton themselves.
Ill probably print them in a flexible resin material, so that way i can paint them and they will have flex.
the plates are fine as designed i guess, someone will prit in platic, and just have to be very precice with placement of them

i have a few more pieces to show, ill do a seperate post

 

[beren88]

here is the jetpack

https://imgur.com/rdwn4n8

and shins

https://imgur.com/KIKgwyj

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

On 5/31/2024 at 10:14 PM, beren88 said:

here is the jetpack

https://imgur.com/rdwn4n8

and shins

https://imgur.com/KIKgwyj

Jetpack looks perfect, great work!

For the shins, it looks more like there is a separate knee pad, rather than it being a part of the shin armour:

It's also worth noting the shape of the knee armour, and that the cut out at the top of the shin armour is more of a semi circular shape than the angled version you have in the first draft there.  Keep up the great work, you're nearly there 👍

[SoulArt]

Hey all. 
Ive been reading back. And have a whack of pics myself. 
as I’m sewing these funky pants, I have some concerns on text to construction. As well as any concessions on seaming on the rear end. 
 

seams-  double lapped. With only single seam. There are no center inner or outer leg seams. Only those on the inner panel portion of both front and back. . And circumference around top of knee. Nothing runs down the center outer leg. Nor center inner leg. The little butt panel, I need to discuss this with those judges allowing the construction. Pics I see have no crotch seam or one boing up the rear end. That’s a bit problematic especially if you’d like a nice sleek bum looking fit… ha! I messaged both Daniel and Ryan for a real time phone conversation regarding this   

color- pale grey for Saxon. White or winter white for the grunts. 

fabric- some form of mid to heavy weight cotton/spandex/lycra blend. Stretch cotton twill. Heavy weight stretch suiting. 
 

I've made 4 pairs of pants thus far and cannot create a nice looking arse with no seam under crotch. 
I await messages from those in charge of this CRL. Thank you!!!!  

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

No worries Teresa, it's always a help to have input from members with technical knowledge when it comes to the construction of these - all the more so when we're trying to translate something from an animation to something that can be worn by a real human being.  We'll figure out something that works I'm sure.

[MisterxM]

I'm sure we can do something with that all together. Maybe is still a chance to made a next, fifth pair, for me 😉

[SoulArt]

I made a 5th pair today out of black 4 way stretch. Lovely! 
not fancy butt panel but cool seams. 
im going to create a smuggler out of them! 
however. Unless we find a tube material no seams, you aren’t creating these lower legs either! There’s no seams on the portion attached just to above knee. Except at that attachment point. (As per screen pics)

[beren88]

Hello all
Whiel teresa is workign on pans, i did a few more modifacations to the chest, belt, and gauntlets.

How we looking?

 

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Brilliant work Kevin!

Just one final tweak needed to my eyes - sorry, I probably should have explained better during my last review.  You got rid of the raised ridge near the top of each gauntlet, but now you have that top section sitting much lower than the rest of the gauntlet:

None of the reference images that I've found show this.  All surfaces on the gauntlets are at the same elevation, with the sole exception of the bevelled edge down at the wrists.  The overall shape you have is perfect, it just doesn't need to be inset like that at the top.  Once you bring that section up to the same level, the model should be perfect.

 

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

10 hours ago, tipperaryred said:

Brilliant work Kevin!

Just one final tweak needed to my eyes - sorry, I probably should have explained better during my last review.  You got rid of the raised ridge near the top of each gauntlet, but now you have that top section sitting much lower than the rest of the gauntlet:

None of the reference images that I've found show this.  All surfaces on the gauntlets are at the same elevation, with the sole exception of the bevelled edge down at the wrists.  The overall shape you have is perfect, it just doesn't need to be inset like that at the top.  Once you bring that section up to the same level, the model should be perfect.

 

I agree with this assessment as well, as evident in these shots:

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

Full text on Page 1 has now been amended with a few tweaks to the flight suit and hand plates following previous discussion with Teresa and Kevin.

The only part still to be done from scratch is Saxon's rifle.  Do we have any existing CRLs that use the same model?

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

This seems to be a blaster that's unique to the ISC, so I guess we'll start from scratch!

 

Optional Accessories

Items below are optional costume accessories. These items are not required for approval, but if present appear as described below. If adding in an accessory after initial approval, the item still needs to be submitted to local GML for approval before use.

Imperial Super Commando Blaster Carbine

• Unique blaster carbine accurate to screen references.
• The receiver and scope are painted in three tones of grey, matching visual references.
• Dark grey / black telescoping stock with an end plate and circular recessed detailing (may also be painted) on either side.  May be functional.
• Dark grey barrel protrudes from the end of the receiver, with a light grey cuboid shape protruding underneath.
• Symmetrical detail indents (may be painted) on each side of the receiver:
  • 3 rectangular shapes
  • 2 circular shapes
• Symmetrical detail indents (may be painted) on the dark grey / black grip.
• Rifle scope scaled correctly to the blaster.
• Dark grey dual front and rear sights on either side of the scope, with a dark grey circular greeblie sitting just behind the front sights.

OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable):

• Telescoping stock should be functional.

[tipperaryred[CMD-DCA]]

One additional tweak I would like to suggest to make the costume as accessible as possible without sacrificing accuracy - the "detail indents".  These black lines are present across many of the costume parts, and we went with the "detail indent" language to stay consistent with similar costumes in other Detachments.

As we've noted in the discussion however, the animated style does not clearly show a change in elevation for any of these "indents".  I would therefore suggest the possibility of adding a special notes that allows these details to be painted on, rather than having to be sculpted into the armour.  IE. Giving GMLs their own discretion to clear both methods of highlighting these details.

Something along the lines of:

• Where this CRL refers to a "detail indent", these details may present as either a recessed detail sculpted into the parts and then painted black, or be simply be painted onto a flat surface in black to create the same visual effect.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

I'd be fine with both as long as it allows for it to be consistent amongst built costumes.

[IcyTrooper[CMD-DL]]

For the carbine for L2 I'd change the should to shall:

• Telescoping stock shall be functional.