Blackwatch

Any progress updates?

My helmet is in work, krysis is pepping it out. I got fed up with hearing " ill start yours in another couple of weeks" after people that ordered after me had theirs and got my money back.

Lets focus on what we need to approve for base level. We can go down each side path once the base is determined.

I'm at work today and I tried to reply on the work computers but it did not go through. I am on board with the L1 L2 proposal. Heres what I propose: L1: Basic four box pack with top charge plus shovel. This is seen in the last art source on the first page of the proposal. L2: At least four options from the list, set up as a source art trooper. Pick a trooper and stay with his layout.

Looks like a good roundup of the items seen in the art. The Sappers have more gear and some of us already have most of this. I altered the pouch portion of the CRL to reflect it. The chest pouch has its own entry, and snaps were already an L2 requirement coming over from the original Engineer CRL. Here is a possible pouch for that dump pouch on the side: https://tacticalgear.com/blackhawk-utility-nalgene-bottle-pouch-black?hp=y What I DO find odd is the lack of E11 holster on the LBE belt, even though they are carrying E11s. The Army trooper has it but I have not found it on the Sapper. What are our collective points of view on the proposals made last night regarding the pack layout, as a L1 (standardized pack ) or L2 (pick a guy and stick with that layout) ?

Currently I have parts for a harness LBE, and I have seven pouches. The green french gloves are on order. I wll be waiting a bit more on the hat / and or/ helmet, so thats not happening real soon. All the parts I have are painted Montana Gold Olive Green so everything will match the CRL and source art.

if you can totally hide it, maybe? Im going to start with a slab and work out from there.

im liking what Im seeing. Which gloves are you using? It looks like the sleeve is tucked in. I still need a helmet, so Ill be waiting for a while on that. But my Trooperbay pouches came in today--how did you mount your pouches to your pack? I was going to take the slanted loops off the back and make a sleeve to put back there for the belt to pass through.

Raider I have read and re-read your point about L2 and L1 approval for packs. If I read it correctly, L1 is basic pack, with a standardized , set charge. L2 would be options per a single individual pack. Would this also require matching belt pouch layout? Neal that was my original intent, a level of mix and match up to the person laying out the pack. Looking between the three options, and after consideration (as well as experience as a judge with mix and match Rebel Commandos), IMO it may be better to go with the L1 L2 setup described by Raider above. If a Sapper wants a specific layout, match the panel. For a L1 layout, we pick a basic layout (IE top charge, side charge, bottom charge, shovel). Im with you on the use of the term Sapper ; I do not want to start an all new topic, but the term has been used quite a bit within the forum. Lets get the CRL bits nailed, then lets discuss why we feel its the more correct term for the art.

i looked up the pantone. There ARE model colors that shade, but model paint isnt very tough.

Theres certainly a happy medium. I joined when it was mostly text and a crappy picture. Thats what I had as a Rebel Infantry judge. It gave me leeway when I had applicants from Eastern Europe that could get something close to right, but were unable to obtain US goods due to import duties and did their best with paint colors. EDIT- back to the CRL proposal, looking it over, and the past discussion, other than what weve just discussed here I agree with what I see, unless Im just completely missing something.

IMO and based on ten years in the club working with GMLs, who will be the final authority to approve it, I see two things with colors: 1: its GREAT. Tells you exactly what to get, and GMLs will love you for using the colors listed in the CRL. 2: it defines the only acceptable color per the CRL when it comes to the L2 standard. Ive seen time and again where overzealous GMLs reject things because of how defined it was, especially internationally. In my experience using the term "such as Pantone350U" will solve problems for approval down the road. Its a very small change but adds up over time.

ive gone back through the discussion about four pages in an effort to catch up. Two things come to mind: While we do strive for accuracy, we can paint outselves into a box when we use specific item codes. What is available now in your part of the world may not be in two years in another part of the world. Rebel Commandos outside of the US deal with that all of the time with the paint colors and boot availability (Import duties and all) , and when I was judging I had to keep that in mind. I have also seen GMLS read something so critically that what was accepted by almost any other GMl was refused because it edid not meet the exact model number or description in the GMLs opinion. Ive dealt with that plenty of times. There has been a lot of work put into this, and it will be approved as a CRL, but we want it to be right, as well as reasonable to obtain, and these points have been brought up on most of the parts of this discussion.

That was the call that Izzi had made several posts back: there would be one version of the pack, which would loaded. I had originally written the proposal with an "unloaded" version [returning from the canyon] and loaded, as described above. After thinking about it, I concur that the pack SHOULD be loaded to some degree. I wrote it based on the various configurations we see in the panels, broken down the way I described them. I even found one panel that had a shovel and "grenade string" on the same backpack, so I altered how the proposed CRL was written. To me these troopers each carry a part of a complex explosive. Even their pouches are different. The charges are different sizes and shapes, and not all have a shovel. One has a box on the side that looks like an old antenna pouch. to me, from this panel it appears that almost all troopers have a top mounted charge. The guy to the far left is hard to tell the way it is drawn, we cant see it but that does not mean its not there. Assuming the two paths for the pack, either a la carte as above or a single universal loadout. Here's a proposal for a single loadout, at least what I would personally want to carry: Top charge which spans longer than the pack is wide Bottom charge which is smaller than the pack Shovel, which will be flat, and not tubular. In a couple of panels the shovel looks like pressed / stamped steel with a bicycle grip added to the handle. Cheap! Optional string of grenades which is seen more often than the box on the right side. https://i.imgur.com/M45LiWY.png

I updated the boot part of the CRL to reflect the commuter boot as the preferred boot. super happy to see the strikethrough and color options back!

I dont think the level 2 requirement line got added in, referencing back to my reply above. While It can be added in but I havent seen much of a difference in the pouches in the panels they are in, other than whats already described. New boots Original boots https://i.imgur.com/DuHoMhc.jpg

This looks like a good start the color flap tab should be pointed like the art shows. You can tuck it under and Stitch it. To me the color on everything else looks good. Adjust your built so that it sits lower and you might try moving the H harness back straps in one hole to get it to lay down on your shoulders. When you look at the backside of the trooper their harnesses are slanted. I had to rebuild my harness three times to get it right. Also you will want to remove the velcro patch tabs with a seam ripper or very sharp knife.

Here is the start of my Imperial Army Trooper. Elbeco coveralls, straigth from the box. Commuter boots (see how short they are, and no extra stitching) I have made my harness and pistol belt, but not put them together yet. Both are painted Montana Gold olive green spray paint. Painted up a couple of dump pouches in the MGOG paint, and I ordered a few M47 cuff pouches. Need more pouches! i will order the french green gloves found at sportsmans guide. My hat maker is on recuperation but she will make my hat when shes ready and healed, and I sent her vintage OG107 fabric to make it with. I have had discussions with a holster maker to make a green holster matching my gear color.

I updated the names. Gianluca I edited to show you have received yours. If others who are on the list here have received them please let me know so I can update the topic and keep it current. Josh its good to see you in here!

that is good news! I am back now, I will go through this topic and post up who currently needs them on the front page.

freakin wow

Jon did the pair you have have decorative stitching like the pair linked above? I may be able to slink into a shoe store and have a look see tomorrow. Notice I said slink--not stroll. I like to get IN and OUT of shoe stores!

back when I was building BSG Deck Gang helmets I made the outside from a custom mold and the inside was pool noodle foam wrapped in black spandex. I will likely do the same for mine.

im with you. It looks like I dont have all the editing tools in the current forum setup that I had on the last forum, i had some pretty sweet moderator tools. This one is basic, so it was easier just take text out since I cant do strike through or color change, etc. Under level 2 in the blue text I had put that the boots need to match source art , which "should" have covered the commuter style but I will set up the boots for level 1 jack and level 2 commuter, and we can discuss that and how that will shake out. I found a pair pretty easy---that is NOT something I have said often in ten years of costume building! I carried the PRC-77 radio mount backpack and it was not at all comfortable, but has a similar appearance. For now I will leave mention of the frame and how the boxes out. https://www.ebay.com/itm/PRC77-PRC25-CARRYING-HARNESS-CARRIER-RADIO-BACKPACK-FRAME-BAG-PRC-660T-SEM35-/173280050729 ADDITIONALLY, this is another item to discuss. In the image below you can see that the artist intended for some text on the tab. it does not show in other panels because the tabs are too small, but this tab (highlighted) is clearly showing some sort of text. I feel that this needs to be an option for the uniform since its represented here. I also agree (other arrow) that the pack has a slab mount. Everyone please go back through the document and make sure I have not missed something, or if you see something that needs to be fixed.

hey everybody, my floors are done, I have my house back, and I am back! Ok, let me catch up on a couple of things. ...... Ok I read up on a couple of things, and I see what you are saying. Matt Nelson did the original art for the commlink, binocs, pack etc. He works with Crookknight, so the discussion could be made that his renderings would be intended to mount to one of the backpack frames. Honestly, Im with you either way--I have a BSA pack and it looks wrong for this application. Lets say for discussion I just edit out the part about the frame, how will it all hold together? Neal I totally agree that the frame could be concealed- we have been making internally framed packs for a long time, but those have a sack around the frame. I made a Squirrel Girl tail a few year ago and put the whole rig on a back board made out of sintra with hidden straps that went under the fur suit. Would it be advisable to make the pack out of a luan board, heavy sintra, etc? That would remove the frame, and keep in kind with the art. Here is something my research turned up, I remember seeing stuff like this in old books. https://huckberry.com/journal/posts/history-of-the-backpack . I need to make a mockup once I get my table moved back in place, but I have a few large sheets of heavy cardboard I use to mock things up and can come up with a protoype based on Matts renderings, without the tube frame. On the boots I have also received my commuter boots (THEY FIT! Im size 14EEE and they FIT!) and I will modify the CRL to reflect this as well. ADDITIONALLY---I have continued to study the photos and realize that I made an error. There is an image of a trooper with the "grenade string" on his back as well as the shovel. In THIS panel (below) the shovel looks like stamped steel!!!! it does not look tubular at all. maybe I am wrong, but the shading does not look like tube stock, and the cheapest thing you can issue a grunt is stamped steel.