Blackwatch

I have been at a convention all weekend and it absolutely sapped me. Absolutely no pun intended. The drive and the Heat and everything else and then going back to work today just took it out of me. If we have hit all of the points then I guess we are waiting for a pack to be completed so we can get submission photos.

We see it in one panel. It's something we can discuss. Does anyone have input on the proposal for verbiage regarding the commlink antenna clips and greeblie position?

OK! SO, lets break this down. As discussed above it was beleived this may be a suitable Han Solo variant. We know now that is not the case. It is a tan coverall only. Lets take a look at the helmet first and make sure what we have written is what we see in the art in the three frames at the top. Discussion: After careful review of the helmet, I believe that in most regards it is the same at the Armored Ground Commander. I do not see evidence of the circular ring antenna. If it were present, it would be visible in both the Veers and the female commanders views. The five rectangular clips, and the six screw heads are also not visible, but that does not mean they are there. There are makers that build these helmets in this fashion (Tambo comes immediately to mind) . With that in mind, and given that this would also have the rod style greeblie inset into the back of the helmet, I I propose that we alter the text of the helmet CRL to read as follows, with no changes to the rest of the text concerning Level 2, microphone headset or goggles: PROPOSAL

Neal i like it! So it seems we are in agreement. Cool name, less confusion between the type. Actually other than the pack I carry all my Army gear in a parachute bag. I hated my duffle in the Army, and snagged a para bag ad it held SO much more. Tomorrow night Im leaving for the weekend where I intend to spend both days in my Engineer.

It may come down to it that Han has his own, but its probably better off to create the footnote for now. If needed another version using the same text would be fairly rapid to create, but duplicate.

Im with you on this, and we seem to be the first two.

Kevin thanks for sharing that. It brings us to a great point about the armor, that is easily missed. Your MonCal set, Snowtrooper sets, my own Scootch gear, and all that I have seen have the raised double bar on the right side. Per the proposal, the "silver greeblie" may be omitted. A trooper could grind it away and back fill it with plastic, bondo it and paint it and it would fine, because it matches our other source art. In this art, the greeblie reminds me of the Harrier model part used on so many ESB and ROTJ costumes. It looks like at lest half of it in the art, cut up and moved around. The part is used on so many things, most visibly Endor Troopers, ALL OVER Boushh and as the rank on Lando Calrisians collar. If a person wanted to go to that level, that would be great, and if not, that would be great too because its art and its up to the artist. But at any rate, its an optional item to have it or not, per the proposal. The one thing that does seem to be consistent here in our art is the color of the helmet, and minus reflections and shadows, the armor somewhat matches. Do we want to further define which "grey" will be used for the armor and helmet, or leave it to the individual and their GML? Primer Grey varies wildly, but my preference as far as color has always been Rustoleum 2X primer and paint grey.

Kevin thanks for posting that. You will possibly be lead on this, so please post EVERYTHING you do, have, acquire, obtain, come about or finagle. two questions for you, and a comment 1 your officer blouse looks fabulous. It looks very well constructed and the collar is perfect, however: This brings me, to the tan jumpsuit which is being defined for this costume. Did you post the helmet/goggles and headset for reference, intending to make the tan suit? 2 Who makes the helmet you have? I maintain that you cannot have enough of these helmets, and I have four being made for myself at the moment. 3 did you make your headset, and how is it to wear for a while?

@Raider one of the first things we need to do is clean up the text and remove the extra characters from the forum move. With the color, we need to make sure that the helmet & mask color match the other part descriptions.

Kevin thats a good question, and welcome to the forums. Thats often the case when there are officer variants of a uniform--who gets it. We have Lt Sunber here in our Army forums after developing the CRL.

awesome!!!! Ive seen his packs. they are beautiful. I hope he had no damage. Ive been through every storm in South La since 2003. Not much good to say about them. SO, is everyone happy with the wording as proposed? Is there anything else we need to cover? If not, then I would like to turn our attention to exactly what we will call this uniform: Discussion: The current proposal is called the Combat Engineer, which makes a modicum of sense. Wikipedia- the knower of all things- tells us that a combat engineer is a soldier who performs a variety of both construction and demolitions tasks under combat conditions. Engineers may build peacetime structures, and this is what most engineers do, most of the time when not deployed. Other terms for this specialized field soldier are "pioneer" or "sapper" and each Nation treats the term differently. Within the US Army, Sapper is a specially trained soldier, whos primary MOS is not combat demolitions or building earthworks, revetments, bunkers or large defilades for armored vehicles. They may be regular Infantry that received intensive skills training, and are typically entitled to wear that nations skill tab, patch or other skill marker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combat_engineer Id like to hear from the Command Staff in addition to anyone interested in this project, since it will be the term presented to the LMO. Will we be calling this a Combat Engineer , Sapper or another term, maybe even a combat demolitions team?

Its not, but at least Automotiveworkwear suits go on sale all the time and you can easily do the conversion. Heres my original build topic when I built the first suit. Page 2 has pocket photos of how I put them on. This was my WIP as a FIL costume, so a lot of things changed while I was making it with both Det and LMO input. The big pouch on my back had velcro that I took off. I cant let good velcro go to waste on a pouch thats just getting stuffed with rags. I added two snaps to it. The other pouches had their little nylon loops cut off, added a black snap and stitched in them place. Easy stuff. Things to keep in mind : There are only four pockets, and they have flaps. I used spare suit materiel to make a proper Imperial collar (ive converted many many many "flightsuits" for both Legions). I used the original collar to make flaps for the chest pockets. The leg pockets sit rather low, and should be stuffed. Mine has foam and rags to stuff them. A snap is seen on the collar. this is not typical for the Imperial forces but seen in the art. On my green suit i used leg fabric to make a simple closure after folding the collar down on itself, and stitching it so it would stand up. If you want to go whole hog with the collar, this is how I do it: This is the same collar template I used in my Imperial and Rebel flight suit tutorials you will see scattered across the Legion Det forums. Ignore the point in the back, thats from ESB. This is made from two pieces of fabric cut on a bias, topstitched together face to face (wrong side out) and then flipped right sides out, ironed all to hell and back ( I iron everything to death), and stitched all along the top and along the chevron closure tab. ALSO, I plan ahead and sew soft side velcro on the tab before i sew them together. You do not see where I added the velcro closure that way, its hidden on the inner collar face. Leave plenty of fabric on the bottom when you cut the template out, and fold and iron this under. I stitch the inner face to the coverall neckline first, then stitch the outside down. Its both sturdy and looks neatly finished.

you know, i honestly dont know. A shovel could be cast up, as long as there is a mold. A toy sand shovel may not be a bad starting point. There is plenty of evidence for flat stamped shovels (CHEAP EMPIRE!!!) and some that look like they may be tubular. Its a shovel. I went with Sintra because I have so much of it , its black, and it weighs nothing. My entire pack is 3MM and 6mm Sintra and its fairly light. But anything can be molded, as long as enough silicone is bought to make the mold. My engineer was pretty well disassembled at a recent con. I paid for my ticket and came in the front and they went through each pouch AND pocket (as well as all bags, purses, carrages etc). I held up the line a while as I removed all the stuffing from my pouches on my hips. Some of the stuffing and foam is glued in and they were satisfied that I was nto going to attack anyone with my glued-in pouch stuffing. Shovels----thats different. The new Security Forces Im starting to see at some of these cons will be able to feel it and determine it is not harmful. but anywhoo heres my shovel. i weathered it in the mud where my front yard used to be before the Parish contractor destroyed my yard and my street for road improvements.

Kerry you might want to add an inch or so to that strap on the back of the shoulders. Otherwise Im digging it. That green patch sure does set off the black, doesnt it!?! but there is one bugaboo, the leg pockets go on the sides like BDU pockets. they ride kinda low, too. I thnk I am using the same coveralls you are.

@TX-15293 Neal with Crookknight making the prototype pack, which charges are you going with? Did you determine which top charge he will make it with? it will pretty much define the L1 pack. Essentially which of the top charges will be preferred, (long or short) or will we use both at troopers discretion? Also everyone my computer is acting really stupid. I spent most of last night trying to get online. Not only for here but for job search stuff. Peckign things out on my phone just doesnt work half the time.

I thought the colors were already defined. the term pill bugs me. "Elongated oval, depressed/ raised oblong" both seem more descriptive since half the meds I take are round pills. its a minor term change.

Ive looked at my printed out pics, and I see its clear that there are two layouts-with and without MP40 pouches. Those wihtout MP40 pouches have the dump bag on he left leg. The charges vary with the art, but clearly some do not have the MP40 pouches. (exiting the canyon photo) PROPOSAL For Basic Approval: Four boxes with a top explosive charge mounted. Level 2 pack and matching belt pouches: (Option 1) In addition to top charge, the bottom charge will be mounted as well as the entrenching shovel. The long black right side pouch may be mounted to the pack to match source art. Two black belt pouches are mounted on either side of the belt buckle near where the harness meets the belt. MA47 double handcuff MOLLE PALS or other black nylon utility pouches are acceptable. Black Canvas or leather or faux leather MP40 pouches are located on both hips. Two or three (depending on spacing on belt) black Molle Strobe type or magazine pouches are mounted behind the MP-40 pouches (Option 2) In addition to the top charge, the pack will have a string of explosive charges mounted to the back as well as one large explosive charge seen mounted to the side of the pack. Two black belt pouches are mounted on either side of the belt buckle near where the harness meets the belt. MA47 double handcuff MOLLE PALS or other black nylon utility pouches are acceptable. Black Canvas or leather or faux leather MP40 pouches are located on both hips. Two or three (depending on spacing on belt) black Molle Strobe type or magazine pouches are mounted behind the MP-40 pouches . A large black pouch with two snaps is mounted to the back of the belt.A large black side pouch dump pouch etc. is located on the wearers left, behind the MP-40 pouch. The dump pouch should have a leg strap to keep it in place. This brings me to the top charge, which I dont think we have discussed much. In the art very few of them match, and currently I have two charge descriptions proposed. One is wider than the pack seen in option 1 art above, (its going to catch on EVERYTHING at a troop) and one that is the width of the pack seen in the same panel. I also see different end caps. Which one do we really want to go with to cut down confusion? I am perfectly happy using the charge that is as wide as the pack boxes. its pas midnight and Ive literally been staring at Star Wars images all day, I think Ill head to bed.

Based on these images the round ear pads would be L2. clearly the artist took the time to draw earlobes so not all have the earpads. Also @Scubacat this is the art you saw that has the markings on top of the tube, its one of two instance where it is seen indistinctly, but clearly not present on all tubes. Im all for plastic and possibly fiberglass. I think the days of luan plywood for boxes are past. Mine is nearing completion and its Sintra (PVC plastic) Personally after thrity years of working with resins, fiberglass, acrylic, PVC sheet and plastic, Im not sold on 3d stuff, ive cleaned too much of it up, BUT hey, as long as the print lines arent so thick they can be seen in the photos, that would be up to the costumer and their GML for approval, and Det for the Level. Ive identified several pack layouts. One clearly has a large flat surface on top of the box, like its a planter lip. Some have curved "webbing" between the boxes. Others have a rectangle in the vertical valley. We spoke earlier of creating three packs, and Neil had a proposal for L2 packs. Since the art IS inconsistent on the details like the curved part between the boxes, vs some that have a sharp V, lets just leave it simple and leave that OUT of the pack description. SO- Returning to the pack layout, given what we have discussed thus far, and assuming that the L1 pack will have the top charge in all cases: L1 (Base): Four boxes, top charge. option 1 pack (L2) Charge on the bottom of the pack and shovel Option 2 pack (L2) String of charges and side charge As @Raider suggested previously our pack layout should match our belt layout, however there is not a lot of variety if you are using the suggested pouches. I put on the MP40 pouches on and with the dump I wound up taking pouches off to make room. Last week @Izzy said the shovel should be on each. Based on art, Im not convinced, I thik it is on one half of the packs presented. Ok everyone, thoughts?

By pill hole do you mean an oval shaped hole? I ask,which means somene else may mis interpret it. On the wording of the off centered hose connectors, being off centered to the left and right, the wording does not read well for me, but thats just me. If they are equidistant from the center, would the following work: hose connectors are mounted to the back, at equal distance from the middle of the pack

Ok got more work done: I started building the pack from 3 and 6MM sintra based on the drawings int he forums, and measurements I made from the source art. Also got my harness laid out completely with the dump pouch, small pouches, twin MP40s etc. I condsider it done.

Gloves and cov's. Im looking for another pair of the boots I found to paint green. I havent put the harness together yet but Ive got the stuff and all the parts are paitned Montana Gold Olive green.

Sorry everyone, I got thrown a MAJOR life curve Friday and it took a bit to dig out. One way, or the other, in about thrity days there will be a very real, and very serious, conclusion, and I have no idea which way its gonna go. Anyhoo, I think we are at an impasse on the straps. Backpack shoulder straps or Suspender shoulder straps. The art doesn't tell us which. We need a decision to move forward. PROPOSAL Leave it up to the individual. I realize this opens a can of worms, and it is a non-answer, but there's no evidence either way and in the end, its just a pouch mounted to the chest seen in only some of the panels prior to setting explosive charges. I agree with the round disc shaped pad. Mounting to the top of the strap hides the attachment point. Not all have the hearing protection, about half do, but it is a prominent feature inside the helmet. On that note Im game for letting the member choose whether the caps are above or below the goggle strap. @Raider the straps I made are load baearing and full strength, and ready to bolt onto my pack, made from two hunks of 2" black nylon stitched together on my heavy duty machine. The 1" strip is decorative but matches the art. My length will be set when I build up the back pack platform. For appearance for L2 A member can add a strip of pointy 2" black nylon, a 1" decorative "adjustment" strip, and the little cross strip "keeper" to any existing backpack straps. 2" nylon is super cheap and I used a ID neck strap for the "adjuster" strap

I have to apologize for being out so much. I was notified Friday my company is shutting down and selling off its aircraft and spares. Today Skywest came in and talked to us, they will be taking over the building, (they own it and all the property) and we will all be able to apply for our jobs to start as new employees for Skywest. Ive spent more than a bit of time fretting over a resume and cover letter (havent written one in almost twent years!) So, lets see what we can get done tonight.

i knocked these straps out, a super quick and easy project after lunch. they match the art and if a person has a pack made up, the top half can be whipped out in just a few minutes and added to the existing strap to give the art-correct appearance.

Sorry guys, these double overtime days are catching up with me again and I often dont get home until 930 at night after the commute home. I had my replies all written out and the computer updated. Awesome. I just re-counted all of the black helmets (we wont go into the green helmets on this one) and the count is: Cover cap placement: Above strap: 2 Below Strap 2 Both above AND below 2. The art is inconsistent , heres the proposal now and you can see my edits Helmet For 501st approval: Open face helmet whose base consists of a dome with rim and helmet skirt. The helmet skirt is to be smooth all around with no indentations on the rear. The helmet is black in color with a flat or satin finish. A black trim covers the edge of the helmet skirt and forehead of the dome. Hearing protection is mounted to the inside of the helmet per source art. Black chin strap and chin cup Screw caps are mounted to either side of the helmet per the source art either above or below the goggle strap. I know we have makers such as WTF that are waiting on word on how to proceed with the helmet. Its in both locations, upon reflection and review ALL locations are correct. I say we call it makers choice, and call the caps "up to the individual" with all locations being in the art. I would like to return the helmet proposal to the original language and keep the hearing protection unless we have input directing them to be on top OR on bottom. Can I get further input on that please? On the chest straps the straps IMO should be mounted to the backpack shoulder straps to support the pack and keep the straps from slipping . I have velcro on my harness just to keep it on my shoulder . Unlike my real world LBE Im not carrying a load to pull down on my nylon straps and keep them in place. Therefore I propose that they be mounted to the backpack straps. I have further input regarding the backpack straps. Almost all panels depict the backpack shoulder straps with adjustment straps. I made this mockup, and I would propose the following for any Level 2 approval. Backpack shoulder straps should appear to be 2-part adjustable with a pointed part of the 2" strap overlapping the top half of the strap, matching source art. A 1" strap is seen on top of the back side of the shoulderstrap passing underneath and then exiting the strap near the point joining the lower half of the shoulderstrap past the point. The 1" strap shall have a keeper below the point of the upper strap. The adjustments need not be functional but should match source art.