Blackwatch

We need to keep in mind that the final determination of which Detachment gets the soft version has yet to be made. Fraser Im glad we have your insight on all of this. It is tremendously helpful and cuts through to what was happening on -set. So, going back to our gloves and belt discussion, we are at change log 1.4 with latest revisions. I believe we can lock that down. Change Log 1.4 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Gloves shall have a U- shaped adjustment at the wrist. Dents brand gloves or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Rogue One type Code Disk without grooves at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2" (50.8mm) wide, 3" (76.2mm) tall and 1" (25.4mm) thick. Boxes shall be painted olive grey or gunmetal with a flat finish. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather.

wow guys, just wow. I dont believe we have ever delved into dye batches at anything approaching this in Spec Ops. Face it SO is mostly black. This is some outstanding effort overall!! That should be enough paint to completely paint two full sets of armor, maybe more.

Its a fair point , which we had discussed starting on page 3 and going into page 4. These costumes were made en-masse and who knows what happens when you are doing batches of jackets, batches of trousers and batches of hats. I agree that Aldhani was given the Imperial Reserves treatment, however I feel very strongly that if you are doing just one uniform-yours- you are going to mix one, and at most two batches of dye and go with that. Ive had VERY little success with dyes over the 14 years ive been doing this, so I make one batch and hope it works. The fabric will take the amount of dye the fabric will take. With our current text the CRL calls for the fabric to match. Officer uniforms call for the fabric to match in weave and color, with at least some of the CRLS stating that the weave of tunic hat and jodpurs exactly matching. Ours gives just enough room for slight variation in color, while the fabric must match. Currently there are two makers, IB and Jim Tripon making these, and soon there will be more. @TeaJay is experimenting with his batches, using provided scrap fabric, and we shall see how his progresses. Our belt lines, which we have no evidence for not being in place, are written as L2 so a person can re use a belt they already own without lines.. I'm making all new belts with the grooves in place already, its just a step before I dye the leather, so if it was a L2 option which later becomes an L1 (like with how the Scouts have changed over the years) I'd be ready for that inclusion.

i forgot, I will add that. Change Log 1.4 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Gloves shall have a U- shaped adjustment at the wrist. Dents brand gloves or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Rogue One type Code Disk without grooves at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2" (50.8mm) wide, 3" (76.2mm) tall and 1" (25.4mm) thick. Boxes shall be painted olive grey or gunmetal with a flat finish. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Belt has a groove along the top and bottom edge along the length of the belt. Buckle may have a very slight curve.

Any chance for pics outdoors, both in bright sunlight and on a cloudy day?

out-standing!

Simon I am with you. Until I joined Spec Ops I never had a leveled costume, mainly due to the boot and calf size. There will always be those members who will go to the Nth degree for accuracy. Others may troop one time a year at night in a Mardi Gras parade. We have several troopers like that here in Bast Alpha. TJ thanks for doing the dye tests. Thats going to help a ton of people. So, if we are in agreement, then we can close out the Gloves and Belt sections. Please let me know if there is further discussion on these topics before we move on. Change Log 1.3 (Final) Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Gloves shall have a U- shaped adjustment at the wrist. Dents brand gloves or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Rogue One type Code Disk without grooves at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2" (50.8mm) wide, 3" (76.2mm) tall and 1" (25.4mm) thick. Boxes shall be painted olive grey or gunmetal with a flat finish. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Buckle may have a very slight curve.

TJ I hate the RIT dyes, I fail far more often than I succed with them. i wish you the very best of luck with this. Please document your entire process, including any boiling and how many clear rinses you did, and whether or not you use salt or other chemicals. I find it makes a huge effect on how finished RIT comes out. Our belt grooves discussion is valid, we cannot see every troopers belt, but all of the characters we can see close to the camera have the grooves in the belt. I know the officer corps has the options on lines & boxes, but what we see here is what we see. We see grooves, and boxes on all that were close enough for the camera to capture. In our Mudtrooper CRLs, which this is based upon, the belt CRL photo shows grooves, however there is no mention of the grooves in the text. With all that said, I cant find any images of a belt without grooves. For me this is an L1 feature. I have several belts, I buy slabs of leather and dye them and add a snap. Is it cheaper? in the end, no, but I control when things arrive and get done that way. Change Log 1.3 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Gloves shall have a U- shaped adjustment at the wrist. Dents brand gloves are most accurate. or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Imperial Rogue One type Code Disk without grooves at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2 1/2" (63.5 mm) by 3 1/2" (88.9 mm) by 1" (25.4 mm) thick The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2" (50.8mm) wide, 3" (76.2mm) tall and 1" (25.4mm) thick. Boxes shall be painted olive grey or gunmetal with a flat finish. Belt is worn high on the waist, close to the bottom edge of the chestplate. Belt closes with Velcro at the rear, right over left. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Buckle may have a very slight curve.

Those are two completely different colors! That photo is great, it even shows that light grey square on the side of the chest armor, and you cannot see the pulley grooves on what would be the Mitchell 78 record player pulley. From looking at some of them they look cast, like cast resin, I do not see the split line where the lip of the box would be. We can write the U as L2, easily done. I'ts not seen, but neither is the strap holding cod pieces to butt plates. I am removing the L2 statement that belt boxes are metal. after inspecting the great image that was provided, I see no evidence these are metal. The edge of the lid are thick, and I see no paint chipping you get with painted tin. Change Log 1.2 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Gloves shall have a U shaped adjustment at the wrist. Dents brand gloves are most accurate. or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Imperial Code Disk at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes, the dimensions are approximately 2 1/2" (63.5 mm) by 3 1/2" (88.9 mm) by 1" (25.4 mm) thick Boxes shall be painted olive grey or gunmetal with a flat finish. Belt is worn high on the waist, close to the bottom edge of the chestplate. Belt closes with Velcro at the rear, right over left. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Buckle may have a very slight curve. Belt boxes are metal, XXX x XXXX x XXXX.

Morning troopers! As always good discussion and all valid points. The belt text is lifted directly from the mudtrooper text, however since it can float around, we can alter it. US Army BDUs had their pockets laid out to put the belt above the lower pocket so you could get into it. Ill rewrite it for variation. For some it will ride under the armor, for others at the lower edge, it will depend on how tall you are. Simon has a point that kept coming up with some of the Rebel costumes, especially the boots for Endor Commandos- those disappeared. Currently the Deahtrooper CRL calls for Doc Martin Jereds for L2. I think we can write it for Dents gloves, or exact replica thereof, as the Deathtrooper L2 CRL is written. Likely there will be a maker come out with a replica glove, especially if it is asked of them. The price point would likely be the same. I did not know there were differences in the belt boxes. I looked at the Officer CRLs but could not find the sizes. I cannot think of but one officer here, that we never see, that even has belt boxes. This is a mostly armored Garrison, and I think we only have the one officer, so boxes arent something that we see here. Im writing it for the olive grey shade, which it looks like to me. But I will need sizes to put in the CRL. lets have a look at this: Change Log 1.1 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. Gloves have a U shaped adjustment notch at the bottom of the wrist. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Dents brand gloves are most accurate. or accurate replica of Dents gloves. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Imperial Code Disk at the center. The belt is worn above the top of the lower pocket flap top edge. The belt features two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. The boxes are Rogue One style boxes. (need dimensions) Boxes shall be painted olive grey. Belt is worn high on the waist, close to the bottom edge of the chestplate. Belt closes with Velcro at the rear, right over left. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Buckle may have a very slight curve. Belt boxes are metal, XXX x XXXX x XXXX.

Moving on to the gloves and belt. These are different from the mudtrooper, so lets begin with change log 1.0 Change Log 1.0 Gloves Black gloves made of smooth leather or leather-like material. Back of glove has four detail lines across knuckles and a wider panel beneath. Middle, ring, and pinky fingers have a stitch 1” (25 mm) below the fingertip. Gloves have a U-shaped Velcro closure around the wrist. Gloves shall have all logos removed. There is no decorative stitching on the gloves. Gloves have a U shaped adjustment notch at the bottom of the wrist. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Dents brand gloves are most accurate. Belt The belt is constructed from a non-textured leather or a leather-like material. Approximately 2" (50.8 mm) in width, up to 3" (76.2 mm) is acceptable. There are no loops on the belt. A single large snap or rivet is visible approximately 1" (25.4 mm) to the wearers left from the buckle. The belt may be worn with the snap to the right or left of the wearer. The buckle is constructed from a horizontally brushed metal, or metal looking material. The buckle size is approximately 2 5/8" (66.7 mm) high and 4 1/8" (104.5 mm) wide with 0.5" (12.7 mm) radius rounded corners. Buckle is adorned with an Imperial Code Disk at the center. Belt is black and is made from two 1.5” (38 mm) nylon web straps sewn together. The belt features six two boxes, one on either side of the buckle. One large drop box on the right side of the belt. Two small and two medium boxes worn in the center of the belt. One long drop box worn on the left side of the belt. Boxes shall be painted olive grey. and be moderately weathered. Belt is worn high on the waist, close to the bottom edge of the chestplate. Belt closes with Velcro at the rear, right over left. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Belt is made of leather. Buckle may have a very slight curve.

Ok, so we have let the bicep and shoulder discussion rest overnight with no further input. Those are fairly straightforward, so Im going to clear and lock, then move to the gloves. Great find on the gloves. Agree, Dents will be our L2, but for basic approval I really like what Gary has linked for us. Change Log 1.1 (FINAL) Shoulder Armor Each shoulder bell is a mirror image of the other. The detailing of each shoulder bell is asymmetrical. Shoulders should have a longer flat edge that covers top of bicep with a shorter flat edge that connects to chest armor. Shallow grooves are present in a pattern matching the photo. Shoulders are painted to match the armor and helmet. Shoulders are mounted to the shoulder strap via a bracket and 1 or 1.25" webbing strap. Optional rank stripes located on the left shoulder may be present. The stripes are painted on. The white stripe is approximately 1" (25mm" wide bordered by a black stripes approximately 5/16" (6.5mm) wide. The stripes may be semi gloss to gloss in color. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Biceps Bicep cover strips are raised and beveled with an added strip layer on top. Biceps are painted to match the armor and helmet.

Ok, so if we are all in agreement with the base text for the Shoulder and Bicep, we can move on. I will let this remain overnight so people who are still getting home and logging in after work have a chance to look through it then we can get to the gloves.

Thats some crazy expensive gloves for basic approval. Theres others that look very similar for a lot less. Durable? maybe not. For the bells how about this: Change Log 1.1 Shoulder Armor Each shoulder bell is a mirror image of the other. The detailing of each shoulder bell is asymmetrical. Shoulders should have a longer flat edge that covers top of bicep with a shorter flat edge that connects to chest armor. Shallow grooves are present in a pattern matching the photo. Shoulders are painted to match the armor and helmet. Shoulders are mounted to the shoulder strap via a bracket and 1 or 1.25" webbing strap. Optional rank stripes located on the left shoulder may be present. The stripes are painted on. The white stripe is approximately 1" (25mm" wide bordered by a black stripes approximately 5/16" (6.5mm) wide. The stripes may be semi gloss to gloss in color. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Biceps Bicep cover strips are raised and beveled with an added strip layer on top. Biceps are painted to match the armor and helmet.

the fishhook is not visible in the shots we have posted for reference. Its at the top of the bicep, and covered by the shoulder bell. I did some paint tests. Black green, German Grey, Tamiya TS4, RAL 7016 etc. The 7016 is dark, almost as dark as the armor. The spray TS4 is the not as dark as the Montana Gold Stealth. So, so far RAL 7016 sprayed over black is the darkest. Model paints are not durable, they are model paint and intended to spray on super thin. A special color would need to be mixed for a custom spray paint at a paint shop.

comments or input? I know its pretty simple, but we do need to confirm it.

Here come the shoulders and biceps. This is direct from the Mudtrooper text. Ill make the edits that we know we do not need such as heavy weathering and montana gold cab yellow for the commander. Shoulder Armor Each shoulder bell is a mirror image of the other. The detailing of each shoulder bell is asymmetrical. Shoulders should have a longer flat edge that covers top of bicep with a shorter flat edge that connects to chest armor. Shallow grooves are present in a pattern matching the photo. Shoulders are painted matte feild grey and moderately weathered. to match the armor and helmet. Shoulders are mounted to the shoulder strap via a bracket and 1 or 1.25" webbing strap. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Green color is similar to Pantone 350U overlaid with Pantone 433U. Biceps Bicep cover strips are raised and beveled with an added strip layer on top. Left bicep is matte field gray with moderate weathering. Biceps are painted to match the armor and helmet. Right bicep armor is painted red with three yellow squares on the cover strip, with moderate weathering. Each bicep may feature a slanted fishhook detail that is inset into the bicep top facing outward. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Left bicep color is similar to Pantone 350U overlaid with Pantone 433U. Right bicep color is similar to Toyota Red 3E5. Yellow color is similar to Montana Yellow Cab.

Thank you! Its been a longgoing issue that no matter what computer I use, and I have several to work with, the text gets boogered. Im going to paste that to the first post of the topic, and finish out the back armor. Next will come the shoulderbells and the biceps; Small enough that we can work both at the same time.

Guys I keep trying to get this text to align ,instead of being pushed out like it is. I have put it in Notepad++ and it still will not line up after I paste it back in. argh.

Good catch on that Oxford comma, which should not exist with the "and" following it. On the raised bars, we cannot see them on all, I would feel more comfortable with them being a permissive item. Should it be L2, the higher standard? Im kinda torn on that. lets try this. As always, discussion is encouraged. Change Log 1.3 Back Armor Back plate is painted to match the chest armor and helmet. Back plate has a collar that extends upwards and tapers to the chest plate. Chest and back plate meet at the sides. The backplate features painted details that vary from trooper to trooper. Acceptable colors for these details are either silver or gunmetal, but one color must be chosen. Mix and match of the detail items is not permitted. There are 2 hose connectors located at the top of the back plate approximately centered above each rectangular cut out/greeblie. Hose connecters are painted to match the strap raised slot, strap buckle and recessed box color. Back has two large cut out recesses with vent details and greeblies inside, all painted silver or gunmetal. The silver or gunmetal paint does not leave the edge of the box opening. The vents at the top of the boxes may have the openings darkened with weathering. Four raised bars approximately .375" (10mm) long aligned to the top of the recessed box opening may be present. Each recess has different and specific set of boxes inside that are painted to match the recessed box color. Light weathering is permitted. Bottom left features a smaller rectangle cut out with the left side stepped. Half circle indent detail beneath the backpack section must be present. There is a long thin raised greeblie positioned central and below the 2 large recess. There is a small raised circle greeblie positioned central and below the above named greeblie. There is a raised slot on each shoulder for the straps to fit into. The raised slots are painted either silver or gunmetal grey. Shoulder straps are black and are affixed to the chest plate at the buckle. The chest buckle shall match the raised slot color. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The hose fittings are angled forward. There is a recessed hole approximately .31" (7.8mm) above the top left corner of the left recessed box. There are two indented squares approximately .25"x .25" (5mmx5mm) aligned vertically above the right upper corner of the left recessed box.

Boss man Mark has reached out to the LMO to request that we recieve the soft version without armor, under the same principle that a TIE Reserve is a TIE without armor. The LMO has not responded but that reasoning is sound. Lets look at cleaning up the back: Change Log 1.2 Back Armor Back plate is painted to match the chest armor and helmet. Back plate has a collar that extends upwards and tapers to the chest plate. Chest and back plate meet at the sides. The backplate features painted details that vary from trooper to trooper. Acceptable colors for these details are either silver or gunmetal, but one color must be chosen. Mix and match of the detail items is not permitted. There are 2 hose connectors located at the top of the back plate approximately centered above each rectangular cut out/greeblie. Hose connecters are painted to match the strap raised slot , strap , buckle and recessed box color. Back has two large cut out recesses with vent details and greeblies inside, all painted silver or gunmetal. The silver or gunmetal paint does not leave the edge of the box opening. The vents at the top of the boxes are painted black inside each cell. may have the openings darkened with weathering. Four raised bars approximately .375" (10mm) long aligned to the top of the recessed box opening may be present. The walls and floor of the recesses shall be painted to match the rest of the armor. Each recess has different and specific set of boxes inside that are painted to match the recessed box color. Light weathering is permitted. Bottom left features a smaller rectangle cut out with the left side stepped. The floor of the cut out and the walls inside match the color of the armor. Half circle indent detail beneath the backpack section must be present. There is a long thin raised greeblie positioned central and below the 2 large recess. There is a small raised circle greeblie positioned central and below the above named greeblie. There is a raised slot on each shoulder for the straps to fit into. The raised slots are painted either silver or gunmetal grey. Shoulder straps are black and are affixed to the chest plate at the buckle. The chest buckle shall match the raised slot color. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The hose fittings are angled forward. There is a recessed hole approximately .31" (7.8mm) above the top left corner of the left recessed box. There are two indented squares approximately .25"x .25" (5mmx5mm) aligned vertically above the right upper corner of the left recessed box.

Ill bring the options to staff and see which way we want to proceed. I like your thinking, I thik we may also make the apron an option, simliar to the guy in the comm shack. I might not get back to this tonight, but Ill pick it up again in the morning. I feel as if we are making good progress overall.

Were going to need to limit how many versions we have. We need to get good grabs of the others that Simon mentioned and have a good look at them as well, for any major differences. In staff discussion its already been mentioned that our paint options are going to give builders fits, as seen with our Deathtrooper and mudtrooper applications. Unless we can come down to some major differentiation point on these guys, essentially 'background extra #8 on the left" two variants should cover the Aldhani versions with the buckles and backpacks. Ferrix will probably be separate, but no guarantees on that. Our staff is leaning towards only two versions, Aldhani and Ferrix, so we may have some rewrite ahead of us again. We may just rename the Garrison Checkpoint to "Aldhani Garrison". We need to cover the soft / no armor version separately. I can add four raised blocks for hero version to the next changelog.

Those are in the ICAT trooper as well. The mudtrooper wasnt seen , so we didnt know as much about it. I believe Jim Tripons armor has it and Ill check my ICAT back plate files tonight when I get home. I believe they are there. I find it interesting this detail is there but the four raised blocks along the top edge of the boxes are gone. Proposed text for L2: There is a recessed hole approximately .31" (7.8mm) above the top left corner of the left recessed box. There are two indented squares approximately .25"x .25" (5mmx5mm) aligned vertically above the right upper corner of the left recessed box.

In that last photo posted it appears the hose connectors match the color of the strap buckle and raised slot. We know from Deathtrooper paint options that it gets confusing, so Im going to try to write this as simply as possible. How about this rework: There are 2 hose connectors located at the top of the back plate approximately centered above each rectangular cut out/greeblie. Hose connecters are painted to match the strap raised slot and strap buckle color. Acceptable colors are silver or guntmetal, but mix and match is not permitted.