Blackwatch

Im catching a felt feel on this, especially folded back the way it is.

Agreed about that "one guy", weve seen that all over the various forums. I would prefer to see the fabric be one color, one dye batch if possibie. Each trooper may look different, but thats normal. Line ten TKs up and one will be yellowish. Ive never seen two TDs match, and most black fabric fades from washing.

@TeaJay you are all over it like a cheap suit! (pun intended) Great work, and you are seeing things that my tired old eyes are struggling to see. The rank bars remind me of plain elastic or webbing. What do you believe they are made from? They stick out away from the arm, makes me wonder if they are felt material. Im for the holes at the belt line. The 1934 (?) pattern Wermacht blouse had them for the internal suspension system, and had internal suspenders to hold the weight of the belt and field gear. Im going to take what you wrote as the outline and work with that. Im going to rename it to change log 2.0. We stated in the hat that the color must match the tunic and pants. If they are to be matching, are we going to allow mismatched colors, or should the maker ensure that the dye batch is all the same? I ask becaue Im part of a club that tries to color match all our uniforms to a consistent shade to match what was seen on screen, but of course variation exists. Saying that, should the hat match the jacket, or the pants, or both? Jacket Change log 2.0 Jacket A long-sleeved, olive green jacket that falls just to mid-thigh, with no visible zippers or buttons. Color of the jacket ranges from olive green to olive tan. Olive drab will not be approved. Fabric has a denim textured material with a visible weave. Has a high mandarin style collar with a left over right closure that rises from the front of the tunic. The front closure overlaps left over right and rises from the hem at the bottom of the tunic to the top of the collar. Four pockets are present on the jacket front, covered by large flapped closures. Lower pockets are larger than the ones on the upper chest. The rear of the jacket has a horizontal seam present near the upper back. Two vertical seams start below the horizontal upper back seam moving down the bottom of the jacket. One pocket is present on each arm of the jacket, each covered by large flapped closures. Above the left arm pocket flap, up to 2 black fabric rank bars may be present. Cuffs on the sleeves are about mid-distance to the elbow. The material folds back on itself to form the cuff. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The jacket may have optional holes near the waist of the jacket to allow tunic hooks to be used to hold up the belt. These optional holes must be covered by the belt. If left arm rank bars are present, the black fabric shall have 3 equidistant horizontal stitch lines through each rank bar. The front jacket flap will have rectangular stitch marks with a stitched X inside where velcro is attached to keep the flap closed. Thoughts and discussion?

OK! thanks for this, this helps and its going to help you. Move those straps so that they sit right on top of the chest pockets, they should come straight down over them. also make sure to get the sleeve down as far as possible so they appear to enter the glove wrist opening. You have the straps right in most of the pics but in one its crammed beside you for some reason. You want those straight. Take a look at your pants leg at the top of the boot. You want that fluffed into the boot, covering the top edge. Not quite a blouse, and definitely not a Imperial-style-cram-it-straight-in-the-boot either. \ You can space your pouches out in back, they dont need to be crammed together so tight. When you take the pics, make sure you do a full go around the CRL and have your L2 pics ready to go.

looking good. its OK to fill out more pouches on the rig, four is the minimum.

Soft good, we will start with the blouse/ tunic. Its not a Mudtrooper tunic so Im not going to use the exact text from the mudtrooper, but I will loosely write a framework that will get us going. Tunic Change log 1.0 A long-sleeved, olive green gray jacket that falls between upper and just to mid-thigh, with no visible zippers or buttons. Fabric has a "pilled" texture with a visible weave. Has a high mandarin style collar with an open space in front. a left over right closure that rises from the front of the tunic. Has two panels on either side of the front, extending to the bottom of the jacket. Has a stitched "cuff" on the sleeve that extends to around the middle of the forearm. Appearance of the cuff may be created by top stitching. If side pockets are present, they are built into the jacket with no covering flaps present. No outer stitched pockets are acceptable unless they are fully covered by the armor. Shall be moderately to heavily weathered. The front closure overlaps left over right and rises from the hem at the bottom of the tunic to the top of the collar. Four pockets are present on the jacket front, covered by large flapped closures.

Never! but yeah we will tab it out like the mudtrooper is. Ok, locking down this version of the Hat, putting it in our "finalized" topic, and moving on to the other soft goods. Just a side note, Im working on another project that is not going NEARLY as well as this is. Differnt clubs, different discussion styles. Change log 1.1 (Final) Hat - Version 2 Fabric matches the tunic and pants. Base of the hat is conical, with a crown about 4" (101.6mm) tall. Front and rear “flaps” overlap on the sides and are about 4" (101.6mm) high. Front bill extends 3" (76mm) down, decorated with (5), (6), (7) or (8) concentric stitches. An Imperial Code Disk is positioned in the center of the front vertical “flap”. OPTIONAL Level two certification Rear flap is slightly lower than the crown heigh (lees than 4") Disks do not feature a notch or groove details.

great work guys! I was on the road for like 5 days so Im so happy to see this solid discussion. Hats have never been a big thing in Spec Ops, you guys have really done great service with this discussion. I figured that the 6 ring hat was a face character, but apparently not. Sewing team A made this size hat, Sewing team B made that size hat and sewing Team C made another size. Before lunch they got 8 lines on. After lunch, only 5. Something like that. I originally felt that 6 rings would be an L2, but apparently not. There is no apparent correlation between the two. So with what Felix has written for us, we have: Hat, Change log 1.1 Hat - Version 2 Fabric matches the tunic and pants. Base of the hat is conical, with a crown about 4" (101.6mm) tall. Front and rear “flaps” overlap on the sides and are about 4" (101.6mm) high. Front bill extends 3" (76mm) down, decorated with (5), (6), (7) or (8) concentric stitches. An Imperial Code Disk is positioned in the center of the front vertical “flap”. OPTIONAL Level two certification Rear flap is slightly lower than the crown heigh (lees than 4") Disks do not feature a notch or groove details. Lets agree, lock this down, and move on to the blouse and trousers.

Moving forward to the hat, which is seen on half the troopers, I like Felix's proposal, and I think we should accept it as written: Hat, Olive - Version 2 Fabric is a medium weight suiting material of olive green. matches the tunic and pants. Base of the hat is conical, with a crown about 4" (101.6mm) tall. Front and rear “flaps” overlap on the sides and are about 4" (101.6mm) high. Front bill extends 3" (76mm) down, decorated with (5) (6) or (7) concentric stitches. An Imperial Code Disk may be is positioned in the center of the front vertical “flap,” but is not required. OPTIONAL Level two certification Rear flap is slightly lower than the crown heigh (lees than 4") Disks do not feature a notch or groove details. Hat, Change log 1.0 Fabric matches the tunic and pants. Base of the hat is conical, with a crown about 4" (101.6mm) tall. Front and rear “flaps” overlap on the sides and are about 4" (101.6mm) high. Front bill extends 3" (76mm) down, decorated with 6 concentric stitches. An Imperial Code Disk is positioned in the center of the front vertical “flap”. OPTIONAL Level two certification Rear flap is slightly lower than the crown heigh (lees than 4") Disks do not feature a notch or groove details.

Ok, its been 24 hours, and with no further comment, Im locking the goggles. Goggles Goggles Change Log 1.1 (Final) Goggles Goggles shall have an aged chrome or silver frame with detail painting and weathering to match reference image. The knurled nose bridge adjuster is brass in appearance. Goggles shall have a trim around metallic frame. Trim shall be rubber or foam. Goggles have a tinted lens featuring two flat panels on each side. Goggle Strap features two sizes of elastic - The thinner elastic strap attaches directly to the goggles and is sewn to the larger strap, which forms the main goggle strap. The goggle strap features a number of buckles: There are metallic buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. A large buckle greeblie on the back side through which the 1.5" (40mm) elastic is threaded. This greeblie features a square inset into the buckle matching the helmet color. Goggles are worn just above the brim of the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Serrated 1" (25mm) slide buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. Goggle straps are approximately 1" (25mm) and 1.5" (40mm). 1” (25mm) webbing should be used to attach serrated buckle to goggles. Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet. Goggle strap has the Telemetry Unit mounted directly to it on the right side of the helmet.

Thats the plan I had, but we need to lock down the goggles before we move on to that. Is there any more commentary on the goggles before proceeding to the rest of the uniform?

I think itwill be fine. I also think that's the same kind of pouch I have on the back of my Colonial Marine.

Making the change suggested, Im going to keep it at change log 1.1. If theres no further discussion on this topic Id like to lock the goggles and move on to the next item. Goggles Change Log 1.1 Goggles Goggles shall have an aged chrome or silver frame with detail painting and weathering to match reference image. The knurled nose bridge adjuster is brass in appearance. Goggles shall have a trim around metallic frame. Trim shall be rubber or foam. Goggles have a tinted lens featuring two flat panels on each side. Goggle Strap features two sizes of elastic - The thinner elastic strap attaches directly to the goggles and is sewn to the larger strap, which forms the main goggle strap. The goggle strap features a number of buckles: There are metallic buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. A large buckle greeblie on the back side through which the 1.5" (40mm) elastic is threaded. This greeblie features a square inset into the buckle matching the helmet color. Goggles are worn on Just above the brim of the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Serrated 1" (25mm) slide buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. Goggle straps are approximately 1" (25mm) and 1.5" (40mm). 1” (25mm) webbing should be used to attach serrated buckle to goggles. Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet. Goggle strap has the Telemetry Unit mounted directly to it on the right side of the helmet.

zippers are acceptable, but how I wrote the CRL they are not mandated. We use the commuter/ totes/stadium boot because its a convenient option. That style of boot is getting harder to find without a lot of decorative stitching on it.

So, hear me out. I cant imagine having a goggle, without a lens in it. Heres my thought- You are out on a troop, and people are checking your gear out. Then they notice you dont have a lens in your goggles. They ask, you reply "its canon". Then they ask "WHY is that canon????? no lens in a goggle?????" and walk away laughing shaking their head. I still feel it was a aberration, just like we had white tape holding the TDs together on Tattooine. I cant unsee the tape now. But, "its canon!" And the right knee cap broke off of Din Djarin's shin armor during the fight on top of the transport. Things happen during production. I watch clocks in the background of TV or movie scenes, I pay very close attention to them, most are fixed at the same time but digital clocks usually arent. I think we need to have at the least a clear plastic lens in place for L1. There is bunching in the back of the strap on the goggle. Would that be where the strap enters the goggle buckle? There is something white visible on left side strap, which unless Im very mistaken is regular old double sided poster tape. Placed above the brim is fine, I can change that. The text comes directly from the Mudtrooper CRL. EDIT-Afterthought Im looking back through our reference pictures. From the side the strap lays flat and tight to the back of the helmet. The point where it projects out would be that large buckle that has the square in it. Would that, Could that be the "buckling" or "puckering" that we are seeing? Are we actually just seeing the buckle itself?

Ok so lets do the revision to the goggle description. I believe we can lock this down quickly. Goggles Change Log 1.1 Goggles Goggles shall have an aged chrome or silver frame with detail painting and weathering to match reference image. The knurled nose bridge adjuster is brass in appearance. Goggles shall have a trim around metallic frame. Trim shall be rubber or foam. Goggles have a tinted lens featuring two flat panels on each side. Goggle Strap features two sizes of elastic - The thinner elastic strap attaches directly to the goggles and is sewn to the larger strap, which forms the main goggle strap. The goggle strap features a number of buckles: There are metallic buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. A large buckle greeblie on the back side through which the 1.5" (40mm) elastic is threaded. This greeblie features a square inset into the buckle matching the helmet color. Goggles are worn on the brim of the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Serrated 1" (25mm) slide buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. Goggle straps are approximately 1" (25mm) and 1.5" (40mm). 1” (25mm) webbing should be used to attach serrated buckle to goggles. Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet. Goggle strap has the Telemetry Unit mounted directly to it on the right side of the helmet.

Hello Alex, welcome to the forum! Please make sure to head over to our Spec Ops Recruits topic and say hello. I agree with Daniels advice above. Good luck on your build, and we look forward to your progress and eventual approval.

Shane I believe those should be covered separately, and may be included as a CRL tab for the different versions, as we did with the Mudtrooper. Once we have the We were told by @fb501 that they were very cheap and broke en route and were removed from a bunch of helmets. I originally thought these lenses were clear; Im not convinced that the lens in the checkpoint guard troopers goggle lens (Mr. Urination) is particularly dark, but I may be wrong about that. Im not hitting "Shade 5" on this; against that dark paint it would appear darker than it is, but I am picking up "shade 3" grinding or cutting sheild style. Looking at the side view of both sets of guards, we can see more light than would normally be transmitted by a Shade 5 lens material.

That pouch looks fine to me, its very similar to the one that is posted in the group of pics for the pouches David Ramsey used when he set up his rig for the CRL pics. Just make sure all straps are night and tight , not flopping about. On the buckle, that happens, so what you will want to do is make sure the buckle is well-sanded for the paint to grip that slippery plastic, and perhaps use a plastic primer to help it bond. There isnt much you can do about the side squeezes, they are forced into a tight channel. maybe keep a cup of the paint right next to you and touch up the belt just before the pics are taken for your L2 photos when you apply for Specialist.

From what we do know, I think the lens broke or fell out or both. Clearly this was shot on the super cheap. There should be a lens in there. The real arguments begin with Hoth Trench troopers where the amber lenses reflect green.

Lets move on to the goggles. This is the base Mudtrooper text, but we know there are differences. from the Mudtrooper CRL: Goggles Change Log 1.0 Goggles Goggles shall have an aged chrome (silver) frame with detail painting and weathering to match reference image. The knurled nose bridge adjuster is brass in appearance. Goggles shall have a trim around metallic frame. Trim shall be rubber or foam. Goggles have dark angled lens a clear lens featuring two flat panels on each side. Goggle Strap features two sizes of elastic - The thinner elastic strap attaches directly to the goggles and is sewn to the larger strap, which forms the main goggle strap. The goggle strap features a number of buckles: There are metallic buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. A large buckle greeblie on the left hand back side through which the 1.5" (40mm) elastic is threaded. This greeblie features a beige square inset into the buckle matching the helmet color. Two black tri-glides on the right rear through which the 1.5" (40mm) elastic is threaded. Goggles may be worn over the eyes or on are worn on the brim of the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Serrated 1" (25mm) slide buckles on each side of the goggles through which the 1" (25mm) elastic is threaded. Goggle straps are approximately 1" (25mm) and 1.5" (40mm). 1” (25mm) webbing should be used to attach serrated buckle to goggles. Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet. Goggle strap has the Telemetry Unit mounted directly to it on the right side of the helmet.

yes, exactly that was my intent, and I know with text it doesn't always come across exactly as we think about it as we write it, so I wanted to get confirmation before moving on. If its clear to others, then we can use the text. Agree that the TU is mounted directly atop the goggle elastic for L2.

We will get to the hat, once we are finished with the helmet and goggles. @TeaJay Ill fix the line, I just prefer to be very descriptive, as I've seen GMLs argue points that we would otherwise take for granted. Since we seem to be in agreement with the helmet description, I will make the one change to the helmet chin cup description. PLEASE review the helmet change log text at the bottom of this post. We need to clear and lock that before we move on to anything else. Once we get to the armor we need to come to a consensus on the color. We agree that: The shoulder bridges are darker than the armor, even when wet on Aldhani. The armor matches the helmet color. The white stripe has a black stripe bordering it which is darker than the armor, even when the armor is wet. The blaster is darker than the armor. When dry the helmet and armor cast greenish grey. When wet the armor and helmet cast grey. The only other color I am familiar with that does this is United States Navy Engine Grey FS 16081. Seasprite helicopters and radial engines were painted this color, and it shifted depending on lighting. This paint appears darker than USN Engine Grey. Helmet change log 1.3 An open-faced, flared helmet which consists of a dome with rim and helmet skirt. A telemetry unit is attached to the right side of the dome and is aligned with the rim. The telemetry unit consists of a rectangle box with detailing that should match the reference image. The telemetry unit color matches the helmet. The lower end of the telemetry unit sits out from the helmet to allow the goggle elastic to pass underneath. The goggle strap is in not mounted to it permanently. A raised lip covers the edge of the helmet rim. Metal/silver Imperial code disks are positioned on both sides of the helmet skirt. The helmet is to be painted to match the armor. The helmet has a grey webbing chin strap and may feature a cup. Chin cup color matches the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The helmet has a webbing style head suspension similar to work hard hats. Imperial Code Disks do not feature a notch or groove details. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet, with the telemetry unit mounted directly atop the goggle strap. If we are in agreement with this and there is no further discussion on the helmet, we can proceed on to the goggles. If there is further discussion on the helmet, now is the time for it rather than down the line after we have it locked down.

Good point on the description of the chincup with webbbing, thats an easy edit. To me the color shifts as the armor moves and Im getting both grey and green tones. I have a color called blackgreen, and its just that; a green that is so dark it looks black, but its green. For the mudtroopers we used Pantone colors when writing the CRLS. We also know the production teams seem to enjoy using Montana Gold color spray cans. Could we be looking at a very, very dark green, which will color shift as it moves under both on set lighting and ambient light? Could we be looking at this? Exposed to sunlight and set lights, with some level of weathering? It's been brought up that the white Corporal stripes appear to have some black shading to enhance their appearance. @TeaJay check my verbiage on that, its late and my brain is fried, is this what you were intending? Helmet Change Log 1.2 An open-faced, flared helmet which consists of a dome with rim and helmet skirt. A telemetry unit is attached to the right side of the dome and is aligned with the rim. The telemetry unit consists of a rectangle box with detailing that should match the reference image. The telemetry unit is black. color matches the helmet. The lower end of the telemetry unit sits out from the helmet to allow the goggle elastic to feed pass underneath. The goggle strap is in not mounted to it permanently. A raised lip covers the edge of the helmet rim. Metal/silver Imperial code disks are positioned on both sides of the helmet skirt. The helmet is to be painted in matte black to match the armor. The helmet may feature a black chin cup with grey webbing strap. has a grey chin webbing chin strap and may feature a chin cup. Chin cup color matches the helmet. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The helmet has a webbing style head suspension similar to work hard hats. Imperial Code Disks do not feature a notch or groove details. I propose the following for including the goggles in the L2 text: Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet, with the telemetry unit mounted directly atop the goggle strap.

Morning everyone, reading and catching up. I agree that the goggles should be in the L1/L2 split, and for my own sanity I would screw them in from behind. I have four of these helmets with goggles and other than Veers they float all over the place. The only reason Veers does not is because there are metal clips that hold the strap in place. My Sapper / ATST and IAT goggles literally slip upwards because of how tightly the strap is stretched, and I have glue on he backside of the strap to try to get it to stay in place. So, lets take a look at the helmet for a moment, then lets work the goggles into it. My L2 text proposal is at the bottom. If we can agree on that as the L2 option, we can clear and lock the helmet. @IcyTrooper thanks for the update on the original post You can scroll up for Helmet Change Log 1.1 An open-faced, flared helmet which consists of a dome with rim and helmet skirt. A telemetry unit is attached to the right side of the dome and is aligned with the rim. The telemetry unit consists of a rectangle box with detailing that should match the reference image. The telemetry unit is black. The lower end of the telemetry unit sits out from the helmet to allow the goggle elastic to feed underneath. A raised lip covers the edge of the helmet rim. Metal/silver Imperial code disks are positioned on both sides of the helmet skirt. The helmet is to be painted in matte black to match the armor. The helmet may feature a black chin cup with grey webbing strap. OPTIONAL Level two certification (if applicable): The helmet has a webbing style head suspension similar to work hard hats. Imperial Code Disks do not feature a notch or groove details. I propose the following for including the goggles in the L2 text: Goggles and strap are permanently mounted to the helmet, with the telemetry unit mounted directly atop the goggle strap.