tipperaryred

Before we move on to the next section, can I confirm that we're happy to go with just a turtleneck for the upper flight suit, as opposed to a specialised neck seal? The concept art does clear show some skin around the top of the neck, so I would assume no neck seal or balaclava is required?

That's brilliant, thanks. It's tallies up with Craig's memory, and I can easily imagine a yellow LED looking white on screen when right next to a deep red LED. Especially taking account of the glaring lighting that was so often overhead.

Thanks a million mate. But yes, last thing we want is any of you guys getting in difficulty, so please don't feel under pressure. If need be we can just go with what appears on screen. I'm sure there's plenty more aspects of the costume that you guys can help with that don't risk putting you on the Mouse's bad side!

Thanks Ardeshir for reaching out to them. Unfortunately we do now have a difference between the on screen images and the on set recollections. Every time the helmet appears on screen in Kenobi, the top LED is noticeably lighter than the bottom one: Craig also remembered clearly on set that one of the LEDs was an orange/yellow colour while the other was red. From your memory, was there no difference at all between the top and bottom LEDs? If so is there any chance of finding any photos or screens to support this? As a general rule with CRLs, the on screen images have to be the number one resource that we use, so it would be very difficult to overrule what appears on the final reel without some clear supporting evidence.

Your rough shape there is exactly what I am seeing in the reference shots too. Once it's stretched out a bit and the gaps filled in, I think you'll have it perfect.

I did yes, thanks a million for that. I'm not seeing any additional issues with it yet, but I'm going to sit down this weekend with all the reference screens I have. We want to make sure that it's as close to perfect as we can get it 🙂

Perfect, I think we may be ready to move onto the chest/shoulder/abdominal armour. Great work all!

Good point on keeping the weathering wording consistent wherever we can. Maybe "Light to moderate weathering, grey in colour" across the board? If we find a piece of armour that doesn't match that, we can specify? Certainly looking back to the helmet, there's a lot more there than I first appreciated, especially on the dome. In all three pics you can see it matching the shoulder weathering exactly: It's also extremely visible on the leg greaves: And to some extent on the torso armour (especially around the chest area):

Ok thanks, we shall wait to hear. Certainly on screen they looked like different colours from every angle and under all lighting conditions, so it's important to get that cleared up. Regarding the rest of the draft helmet CRL, is everyone now in agreement with all the other parts aside from LED colours?

Just to be clear, we're talking about the two lights on the side of the helmet you can see below: On screen it looked like it was red at the bottom, white on the top. However we were told by people on set the top one was more of an orange/yellow. Are you saying that they were both red?

Perfect, I'd entirely agreed with keeping things flexible for lvl1. It's tough enough establishing materials when dealing with live action, and with animation it's practically impossible. Are you happy with that too for lvl1 Kevin? If so, do we have the undersuit sewn up for now? Pun not originally intended, but now that I see it I've decided to leave it there.

I think we all seem to be in agreement on the fabric appearance for the top. The animated style of rebels makes the bottoms a bit tougher. It's difficult to tell whether it's a simple flightsuit of similar material to the TIE pilots, or whether it's something more form fitting. My instinct is towards the first. As Ryan pointed out, even the TIE suits look closer fitting due to the animation style.

Huge thanks to you both for chipping in with your experience, it's always a great help. We've had some very positive discussions already to get the draft CRL to where it is, and with you guys jumping in we may get there even quicker now. So going by the "orange yellow" description from on set, would people be onboard with describing it as "amber", or something like it? It would give people a slight amount more latitude towards either the yellow or orange side.

Yep, I'm 99% sure that you're right on that. I think we can safely leave that off the list 😅 Sure if anyone wants to include it for OCD levels of accuracy, it's hardly going to show on clearance photos anyway. This thread can be a reference for GMLs if the question ever actually comes up. So I can say here that yes, if someone actually paints a large white Imperial cog on the inside of their shoulder armour, it's safe to clear it even though it isn't written in the final CRL! Any other points we need to clarify on this part, or any wording needing further revision?

Yes, the key thing is the appearance, rather than trying to specify just one or two specific materials. I think the description we've developed captures the appearance quite well, and someone using a tight fitting British military pullover of the right colour would definitely match up. So long as the look is right howeve, we should leave alternate routes open to people. Are there any other issues outstanding with the undersuit, or is everyone happy with it as it stands?

My apologies, I forgot that part of our earlier discussion - my brain is still catching up from my absence. Entirely agree with your assessment on that. How does the rest of the draft look to you?

Cheers! Would you mind creating a new thread for your helmet and we can give everything the once over there once you're done. I can't see any obvious alterations needed, I just don't want to give you false promises that they're perfect until we've checked the boots in detail. My instinct is that they're as good as anything you'll find off the shelf though 🙂 Red text is just the text I've changed since the last draft - based on discussions we all had over the colour. Originally I put grey because it was darker than the white armour, but the good point was made that it should be a very light grey (different from the Super Commandos for example). So feedback welcome on all parts, but especially on the most recent changes (yellow and red).

HELMET rewritten - changes in red, with my comments in green. White text we seem to all be agreed upon. To keep things simple, I shall refer to the centre greebles and t-shaped vocodor as one item - "the vocodor". As per Kenyon's info, we'll treat this as a separately moulded piece that is inserted into a recess in the mouth plate. Once we are all happy with the wording, I believe the only slightly contentious issues remaining are the colours of the teeth and the top LED. Unless there is more information on these, we may just have to pick a colour, or give builders the option to pick their own interpretation from the possible options listed below. I would lean slightly towards the second option. Gloss black in colour, consistent with the rest of the costume. Is in proportion to the rest of the costume. The eye lens is one continuous piece with a mirrored red tint and should obscure the wearer’s eyes. The central vocodor should be moulded as a separate piece and is inserted into a recess in the mouth plate. Alternately it may be moulded as a part of the mouth plate, but with a prominent recessed outline to create the appearance of being separate. The top part of the vocodor is rectangular in shape, with two clipped dog ears on the top corners. A smaller plate of identical shape sits on top of this panel, leaving a narrow margin around each edge. There is also an angular cut out at the top of the right edge of this plate. A second rectangular plate sits on top of the first, covering the bottom 40% of the lower plate. There is a raised horizontal line on the lower left side of this top plate. There is a small square recess underneath this raised horizontal line. The main body of the vocodor sits below the panel described above. 9 raised ridges run vertically across the vocoder. Angled "wings" at the top of either side of the vocodor ridges, each slightly under 50% the length of these ridges. These wings angle down to rest on top of the main mouth plate. Square profile side tusks run back from the lower edges of this front plate. Recessed rectangular metallic silver screens are inset into the greeble in the front of each side tusk. Each greeble has a raised ridge on 3 sides, angling up from the bottom side of the greeble. Six pill shaped symmetrical recessed stripes on each tusk, with the bottom of the recesses filled with red to match the pauldron, belt accessories and left bicep armour. Small raised horizontal rectangle with recessed line is located below the vocoder. Raised teeth painted silver, with black/silver in the recesses. Alternately the recesses may be cut out and backed with mesh to obscure the wearer's face. I'm a bit reluctant to rely entirely on the Hot Toys here, especially when the show's screens don't have quite the same look, and that it breaks from usual "teeth" convention. Hopefully we may get a second opinion here. Silver rectangular plate on the nose, between the teeth and the front plate, with a silver half moon greeble on top. This plate is recessed below the angled face plates on either side. The half moon greeble is level with the adjacent face plates. Symmetrical recesses with pill shaped greeble on each side between the side tubes and the cheeks. Top of greebles are split in half with the top half being flat and the bottom half having 4 raised ridges that are level with the flat half. Sharp angular cheekbones sculpted into helmet face plate running in a triangular shape below the lens opening. Three raised ridges run from the centre of the brow, over the top of the helmet and down to the rear centre of the helmet skirt. The central ridge is roughly 2.5 times wider than the ridges to either side of it. Top of the helmet is separated from the face plate by a horizontal band running above the brow. A groove separates the top of the helmet and the rear skirt, running across the back of the helmet, meeting the brow band on either side. The side greebles (communicators/range finders) are attached on top of the joins between the band and the ridge on either side of the helmet. Symmetrical rectangular greebles (communicators/range finders) with semi-circular ridges underneath, present at the back of each side of the brow band, situated on top of the point where the front band meets the rear groove. Greeble contains two raised and stacked squares, each with a circular LED or sculpted imitation located near the front, and a single recessed line in the shape of a square outlining the back two thirds of the greeble. OPTIONAL – top and bottom may be lit using LEDs. Top LED must be white/yellow/orange (more confirmation or references needed on this?), bottom LED must be red. Two small pill shaped double indentation in the bottom corners of the faceplate, under each ear. The rear indentation is vertical and slightly longer than the front indentation that angles toward the front of the helmet.

The shape seems quite close to Ph2 Clone shoulder armour, but the outwards curve in the middle is a lot more pronounced: In the screen above, it does also look like there's a reasonable amount of weathering? I'd propose something like the following: Purge Trooper style shoulder armor. Shoulders are tear drop in shape with all rounded edges, as per the references. Armor is painted satin black. Each shoulder has a red Imperial Cog emblem, sized to the wearer as per the references. Armour should be attached with hook and loop or other similar invisible method. Armor has some moderate weathering. Any weathering present consists of grey tones. IAlso, I saw in one screen there is a huge white imperial cog on the underside 😅 Do we include this even though no one will ever see it?

Thanks for the spot, extra eyes are always welcome! Yes, in this case we already spotted that error in the Hot Toys figure, so we'll stick with the screen reference 🙂 Apologies for the enforced absence all. I shall rewrite the helmet text below and see if we can get this part finalised. It's looking like it will be the toughest part, so it will be great to move on to the next parts.

Thanks Kevin, new renders look great. One missed panel line on the right ear cap, but otherwise I couldn't see any issues: For the boots, they'll probably need some alterations but they look a good starting point! As for the undersuit, yes, as we discussed on pg2 the top and the pants definitely seem to be different material. Would agree with the top being of a similar style to British military pullovers (which are usually made from acrylic). I would suggest either the pants are a separate garment of a different material, or they are part of a flight suit (which then have the ribbed top worn over the top half). More than happy to have someone else jump in with some feedback, especially if they have a lot of experience with fabrics 🙂 So, to get our undersuit finished, this is where we last left it on pg2 (with some alterations from Ryan's earlier work). Fire away with any additional feedback! Must be a two-piece garment, and must be properly fitted and shaped to the wearer. Must not have any visible pockets, pouches or zippers. The upper body part of the flight suit is maroon colored, in a heavily ribbed style similar to acrylic British military pullovers. The neck area of the flight suit goes halfway up the neck of the wearer to conceal skin when the helmet is worn. On each shoulder of the flight suit there is a white Imperial Cog emblem on a black background. The cog is 3” (76.2mm) or 3.5” (88.9mm) diameter and 1” (25.4mm) from the shoulder seam. The cog may be embroidered or vinyl. The lower body part of the flight suit is a very light grey or weathered white . The lower part may be a separate trouser garment, or part of a one piece flight suit. If a one piece jump suit, the upper body jumper should be worn over the garment so as to obscure any view of the flight suit underneath. The lower body part of the flight suit has the following seams: On the outside of each leg there is a double-lapped seam which runs the entire length of the suit showing from the top of the shins up under the belt. On the front just above the top of the knee armor which wraps around to the back of the flight suit and appears on the back. On the back from the knee seam there is a seam that runs up the back of each thigh and then curves to the outside of the back under the belt. There is a horizontal seam that runs across the butt connecting both of these seams running up the back of each thigh. On the back there is central double-lapped seam which runs from under the belt to the crotch of the wearer.

Sorry for delay mate, it's been a crazy busy last week. Can say we're happy with painted triangle rather than recess though. Will check the latest renders when I can, but first impression again is great!

That seems the most conclusive angle we've seen so far, and there doesn't seem to be any recess there. What do you think?

Only minor issues I'm seeing so far. I know you haven't put any recessed panel lines in yet so I won't include anything on those. For the front I think the only shape issue is the bottom of the visor. Compared to the references I think it is slightly too much of a pointed shape. The bottom does need to taper in, but it is slightly wider at the base than in your current draft. For the back, I'm not sure about the gap outlined in yellow above (between the ear plate and the raised shape). It should be straight, and a little narrower I think. The oval greebles (left one highlighted in brown) need to be a bit narrower I think. The central greebles (outlined in green) are raised up in your draft, and I think we decided that they should be flat but outlined by recessed panel lines. Maybe you already planned to fix this when you put the panel lines in? These small details aside, I think it looks spot on. Great work!

Thanks mate, it's looking great on initial impressions. When I get the chance I'll look in greater detail a bit later.